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New "dreaded" oil thread. XPSII

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LouDoo

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This recently appeared in another thread, and I wanted to make a couple of comments.


Quote Originally Posted by Dr Honda View Post
The old oils have been made for a very long time... and I'm sure BRP doesn't care about the old engines. So, where my issues are... I'm sure there was ZERO testing to find if the oils were compatible, or the effects on the RAVE's.

I've been loyal to XPS, and I get a good price local... but since I'm being forced to switch oils... I guess I'll buy the stuff from wal-mart now. (Quicksilver PWC)

Or........

I'll sell both of my 2-strokes next spring, and buy a spark.

OK... not to get too far off subject... but I wonder if the Synth base in the Red-Line oil caused the center seals to leak??? I remember, back in the day... the real synth oils would show you all your weak seals, via oil leaks. I'm not saying it caused the leak... but if it's thinner (on the molecular level) it will get past a warn seal.



Tony,

You are one if not the most respected members of this forum, and you certainly have my respect. BUT I think you are over-reacting on SeaDoo changing the vendor for XPSII. I don't want to hi-jack this thread so I will start another dreaded oil thread. Now where did I see that cat?

Lou
 
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O.K., what I wanted to say is this, manufactures change vendors for their branded oil all the time. I work at an automobile dealership, we have Cadillac, Volvo and Subaru. All three car lines have their own oil and as far as I know none of them make their own oils. They are manufactured by vendors which can change frequently, sometime on a yearly basis. The reason they change in the automobile business comes down to cost. A Kentucky company Ashland/Valvoline manufactures a lot of these oils.

We recently made a change of our "house oil" from Mobile 1 synthetic to Castrol Edge, both what I consider quality oils, which I'm certain was based on cost.

Anyway what all this is leading up to is, and I really don't know but I suspect that Castrol made a decision that is was not cost effective to continue to make XPSII so BRP found a new vendor, Red Line. Everything I have read says Red Line is a well respected company that makes a quality product, everything on the internet is true, right? I have used close to two gallons of XPSII synthetic injector oil and have noticed no difference from the old Castol manufactured oil. So I will continue to use the XPSII.

All that being said I used Quicksilver full synthetic API-TC for several years before I switched back to BRP XPSII and didn't have a problem with the Quicksilver oil either. I changed back to XPSII because I found it at a reasonable price. BTW Quicksilver is wholly owned by Mercury Marine, who I would venture to say doesn't manufacture their own oil either.

So what I'm saying, is sometimes we need to put our trust in manufactures, I know I do with OEM parts, so why not oils also. Getting off my soapbox now.

Lou
 
Well the consensus on the internet points to Citgo, which makes some sense because Citgo owns Mystic oil, I've also heard Mercury/Quicksilver oils are made by Penzoil. That being said it's anybody's guess.

Lou
 
my local dealer sells the xps for $14 a quart and walmart has the quicksilver for $45 a gallon. the dealer is 5 minutes away, and walmart is 10. i am thinking about making the switch but still am thinking about it
 
I'm going back to Caster oils. I can honestly say... I NEVER ONCE lost a top-end burning 927 !!!!!!!! But I know, it will gum the RAVE's.
 
richardpr said:
i am unsure but will probably use quicksilver. but am weary of doing so
Click to expand...

Maybe SBT is just not as big as I think they are but I would think that the ability to continue to have low ash oil in the market will only keep thir 2 stroke rebuild side of the business going. If this oil is phased out, so will the rotax 2 strokes. Would think there is an opportunity for them to get with one of the oil companies and bring something to market...
 
I think the critical part of any oil are the additives, not so much the base stock. Manufacturers closely guard the additives that they add to the oils to give it the desired properties. I believe the same goes for synthetics. So even if Seadoo changed the supplier of the base stock, I would think that the additive package for XPS ll would remain the same.

Meow
 
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Reflecting on the "Get SBT to supply oil thoughts".....



It may not have been Seadoo/BRP who killed the oil. It could have been Castrol. API-TC oils are such a low volume product... and since the BRP oils are SO expensive, I'm sure that a lot of people just use what they can buy local, and as we all know... people like to burn the cheap TC-w3 oils.

Anyway... if the volumes are down... then there is a good chance that the suppler killed the product. AND, in turn... BRP just found someone who would supply an oil with the proper rating. (Regardless of testing)



Like I said... Since we know there is a new oil in the bottle... I'm not buying it, just because it says "BRP" on the label. I'll do my own research, and make a choice. But, since the Quicksilver PWC is known to work.... that will be my next oil to target.
 
I personally have used redline brand oil and it smells disgusting...like ivory soap. Im sure its a different formula for XPS, but OMG I could not stand that smell.

Really...the only motor that needs truly specific oil is the DI motor. All the rest as long as its a good API-tc oil it really doesnt matter. And hell, if you clean your Raves the castor is good cheap stuff.

Personally I use Yamalube. Its widely known they are always ahead of the pack on their products. Ive talked to lots of racers using all sorts of oils and they all say Yamalube is the best, but there isnt anything wrong with X brand oil they are sponsored by.

Again...it really comes down to personal opinion, local availability, and price.
 
i just got off the phone with tom from seadoo engine shop and shared some info with me on recommended oil. he says honda HP2 is hands down one of the best!
has more of a slick film and dyno tested engines using different oils and has results of up to 3 hp added when using honda hp2. he also recommended amsoil sabre or dominator as well as klotz r50. he is not impressed with xpsII as he says it's not like it use to be that the rotax needs. now get ready for this, he also says that my rfi would benefit running premix 100:1 for the life of the engine along with using the oil injection and that it would not hurt the injectors. but would play a role in making the engine last longer.
he also cringed when i mentioned quick silver. ??
tom has been pretty pleasant to talk to and says if i ever have any questions to give him a call. my engine is now in the prepping process and should have it back within 2 weeks.

please disregard this post!!!! see post #37
 
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Minnetonka4me said:
Personally I use Yamalube.
Click to expand...

Wawawawait a minute....the guy that has seadoo oil running through his veins AND makes fun of me for wearing a Yamaha life jacket on my SPX uses Yamahalube!? :o

Maybe I should get my mid to late 90s seadoo parts and advice elsewhere. Oh wait, no I shouldn't :D
 
jammin777 said:
i just got off the phone with tom from seadoo engine shop and shared some info with me on recommended oil. he says honda HP2 is hands down one of the best!
has more of a slick film and dyno tested engines using different oils and has results of up to 3 hp added when using honda hp2. he also recommended amsoil sabre or dominator as well as klotz r50. he is not impressed with xpsII as he says it's not like it use to be that the rotax needs. now get ready for this, he also says that my rfi would benefit running premix 100:1 for the life of the engine along with using the oil injection and that it would not hurt the injectors. but would play a role in making the engine last longer.
he also cringed when i mentioned quick silver. ??
tom has been pretty pleasant to talk to and says if i ever have any questions to give him a call. my engine is now in the prepping process and should have it back within 2 weeks.
Click to expand...

Well that makes everything clear as mud, I don't think any of those oils that Tom recommends are API-TC low ash, and I don't think the Yamalube is either. I knew I should have just kept my mouth shut and not started this thread. :facepalm:

Ignorance is bliss I'm just gonna pretend none of this happened and just keep using XPSII synthetic, and pretend it's not red.

Lou
 
LouDoo said:
Well that makes everything clear as mud, I don't think any of those oils that Tom recommends are API-TC low ash, and I don't think the Yamalube is either. I knew I should have just kept my mouth shut and not started this thread. :facepalm:

Ignorance is bliss I'm just gonna pretend none of this happened and just keep using XPSII synthetic, and pretend it's not red.

Lou
Click to expand...
sorry, i didn't mean to cause more confusion, i was just relaying to what tom said as i was telling him my plans of using xpsII and he gave me his recommendations. i figured if he's going to have to honor his warranty his recommendations must be valid.
that being said the only one ive found based on his recommendation is that the amsoil dominator is API-TC. he swore on the honda hp2
maybe i should have kept my mouth shut!
 
I am so sorry I read this. I thought I was doing the right thing by using the Seadoo brand XPSII synthetic. Now I am reading that since the change it is no good? It is starting to seem the more I read and research, the more confused I get!
 
BiXll said:
I am so sorry I read this. I thought I was doing the right thing by using the Seadoo brand XPSII synthetic. Now I am reading that since the change it is no good? It is starting to seem the more I read and research, the more confused I get!
Click to expand...

Believe me it was not my intention to confuse anyone and I stand by my original statement use either the BRP XPSII full synthetic (my personal choice), or Quicksilver PWC API-TC full synthetic oil. I have used both with no problems with either oil.

Lou
 

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I believe since I can get the 3 gallon case for $99.00 I will stay with what I thought would be best and Lou's reccomendation of XPSII full synthetic
 
BiXll said:
I believe since I can get the 3 gallon case for $99.00 I will stay with what I thought would be best and Lou's reccomendation of XPSII full synthetic
Click to expand...

That's a great price, are you getting your oil from Mosites? I might just go ahead and order 3 gals. for next year.

Lou
 
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