Wear Ring Question and Cavitation

[xintersecty]

Been having issues with cavitation on start with this boat. I got a Solas Impeller as a replacement and will put that in today. Before I put it in the pump, I wanted some opinion on the existing wearing.

I think I maybe ok. It has some groves in it and it still does fit tight.

Here is a pic before I waste any more words


Here is the picture of the old impeller. There is a bang and bent leading edge on one of the blades. Hard to see in this picture.


Here is the new impeller in all of it's shiny glory.


So replace or keep the existing ring?

 

[pwgsx]

Well the ring looks ok to use BUT since its out I would replace it with a new one. They don't cost much $$.

 

[pwgsx]

Also I don't see your old prop giving you cavitation issues. You might have a bad shaft seal / carbon ring issue.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

I agree with PWGSX, and will add the new impeller may fit tight (or loser) than your old impeller, it's the clearance that counts.

So whatever the clearance comes out to be will dictate if the old worn wear ring will work.

 

[xintersecty]

well.... I was being lazy hence I asked the question. The more I dig into this issue, the more I suspect it can be my carbon seal. I just may put the new prop in and check clearance. I do have a new ring ready I just don't want to go through the work of taking the old one out. BTW would the freezer trick work on removal? How does that work?

Also if I replace the carbon seal is that easier done with the pump out?

 

[pwgsx]

The pump and shaft have to be removed to replace the seal. The freezer trick works if the pump is metal, plastic pumps wont work with this.

 

[xintersecty]

OK, I am going to replace the carbon ring. I was looking at the parts list
2 O-Ring
1 C-Clip
1 Support Ring 272000176
1 Carbon Ring 272000177

So assuming the bellows are good, just replace the support ring and carbon ring? I am trying to keep parts to a minimum as I have to go to a real dealer and they will charge premium prices. Also they can't service boats so I have to order "jet-ski" parts (I know it's stupid). If they have the parts in stock.

What really get's replaced when the carbon ring is serviced?

As for the freezer trick, just put the pump (metal) with wear ring in the freezer and the ring should pop out?

 

[pvamax]

Put pump with ring in freezer. I only had to leave mine in there for 30 min and could pop the ring out easily.

 

[pwgsx]

SBT although I don't like them has a driveshaft rebuild kit- carbon ring, c clip, hat and all. I Would replace the black rubber boot too. I "THINK" this is the kit you need but double check, I am on my phone and its hard to search. http://www.shopsbt.com/sea-2006-dchalcsandtow/sea-doo-jet-boat-internal-driveline-kit-sportster.html

 

[Lightningtruck]

I would replace the rubber boot also. Hard to tell when it has taken a bit of a "set" and doesn't push the carbon seal as good as it should. At least it was on mine. Might as well do it while you're in there. It's about 20 bucks.

 

[xintersecty]

SBT although I don't like them has a driveshaft rebuild kit- carbon ring, c clip, hat and all. I Would replace the black rubber boot too. I "THINK" this is the kit you need but double check, I am on my phone and its hard to search. http://www.shopsbt.com/sea-2006-dchalcsandtow/sea-doo-jet-boat-internal-driveline-kit-sportster.html

Thanks for the link. It's a good price and I was trying to rush getting the boat back into the water. I found an issue with the weedless system and that is going to take time to troubleshoot. So I will do the replace/fix/do it right on my pump and carbon seal. Hell, it can't hurt. And yes I will be replacing the rubber boot and saving the old parts as emergencies. BTW I bought an extra starter relay just in case. I had to replace one on my 2007 RXT this year.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

I agree, if you remove the drive shaft then you will want to use the opportunity to replace the rubber bellows as well.

Often, the bellows relaxes over time and doesn't properly tension the carbon seal, result is air is sucked from inside the bilge into the jet pump impeller.

 

[xintersecty]

Often, the bellows relaxes over time and doesn't properly tension the carbon seal, result is air is sucked from inside the bilge into the jet pump impeller.

Well when I bring up the throttle it sucks alright. It's like the big cavitation sound from hell. GRIN. I appreciate all the advice on this forum. I have three days of rain (if not more) and several days of work to keep me away from my boat. It will all work out in the end.

I suspect I am going to have to pull my weedless cable and get that subsystem working. Sigh

 

[xintersecty]

Here is the latest updates and questions. There are always questions...sigh.

OK, I took some stuff off to try and get to the carbon seal, alas the supercharger is in the way. OK I will remove that. A trip the store to by an external torx set (45 bucks) and I got two out of three out and got stuck with the evil one.

This bolt faces the front of the engine and does not have enough room for s socket. In the end I used a 1/4" SAE wrench and about 20 mins of unbolting, dropping and fishing in the bilge. Does anybody have any advice on how to remove easily?

Then once I got it off, the stupid exhaust muffler is in the way. I to loosen it and finally got the supercharger off.

I suspected that this was changed over to metal washers. Here is a picture can somebody confirm?


Now I can get to the carbon seal. I am a bit confused as to what to move first to get the c-ring. I am sorry there was not much light when I took the picture this morning.


Any suggestions would be helpful. Thanks in Advance!

 

[pwgsx]

I heard you can leave that one screw off and have no issues. I read that a few times on other forums but I put mine back on. As for the carbon ring- You really need the tool to make it easy OR get another set of hands to help. You need to pull back on the metal hat which will expose the C clip which is hiding right under it. This will push the carbon ring and black rubber boot to the rear of the hull giving you enough room to remove the C clip. Have someone pop off the C clip with a screw driver but do it fast, it is rather hard to keep compressed.

 

[xintersecty]

OK. Made a jig and with much beating I got the driveshaft out.

Here is the big question. Can I sand this guy down and reuse the driveshaft or just buy a new shiny one?


Here is the other end


At 200 bucks on ebay I would like recover this one.

 

[Coastiejoe]

If the splines are good, then Yes. The splines are the weak link on driveshafts. So either use a wire wheel or light sand blast on the spline area. The rest, clean it big time and paint it.


Repairing and selling iPads, iPhones and Mini iPads.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Sand those barnacles right off of there! Is the plastic grease keeper at the impeller end anywhere to be found? The impeller splines should be loaded with grease and a collar around the driveshaft helps keep grease from washing out.

The PTO end has a grease zert for an occasional pump of grease.

 

[xintersecty]

You really need the tool to make it easy OR get another set of hands to help.

I made a tool that worked. Between that tool, PB Blaster, and whacks with a hammer I got to slide forward.

That is a rough cut oak board. It did the job. I just used a small 2x4 wedged against the engine for a fulcrum. It worked.

Thanks for the advice on painting. I will wire wheel this guy beautiful and then epoxy paint the shaft keep the c clip and splines clear.

 

[brobertov8]

I would also replace the bellows, since in most cases they will fail more than the seal.

I recommend this thread about how carbon seal works:
http://www.seadooforum.com/showthread.php?72130-Carbon-Seal&highlight=carbon

 

[xintersecty]

I would also replace the bellows, since in most cases they will fail more than the seal.

I recommend this thread about how carbon seal works:
http://www.seadooforum.com/showthread.php?72130-Carbon-Seal&highlight=carbon

I am replacing the bellows. In one of the previous comments, I got the SBT kit. It should arrive today. I have been reading and studying on the carbon seal for sometime.

Last night when I was trying to get out of the boat, the flash of light and the genius of the design exploded through the dull slow grey matter called my brain.

The bellows are a spring that pushes the carbon ring against the top hat. That is why everybody keeps saying replace the bellows. And that's why everybody misunderstands the purpose of the bellows.

 

[brobertov8]

Correct!
Previously I also thought the bellows was just a "protection", not a “spring like design”….

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Nice job on the bellows compression device, your bilge looks tighter than mine thus not as much working space. My old bellows is fairly easy to push aftward but the seal doesn't leak yet (that I know of). One of these days mine will need to be replaced too.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Here is the latest updates and questions. There are always questions...sigh.

Now I can get to the carbon seal. I am a bit confused as to what to move first to get the c-ring. I am sorry there was not much light when I took the picture this morning.

Any suggestions would be helpful. Thanks in Advance!

Sorry I didn't see this question, I guess you already found the stainless ring must be pushed aftward against the bellows to expose the retaining clip and while pushing stainless sealing ring aftward the jet pump must be installed so the drive shaft cannot move aftward.

 

[brobertov8]

OK. Made a jig and with much beating I got the driveshaft out.

Here is the big question. Can I sand this guy down and reuse the driveshaft or just buy a new shiny one?
View attachment 26870

Here is the other end
View attachment 26871

At 200 bucks on ebay I would like recover this one.

Your driveshaft really it´s not superb, but I believe you can try it again.
Maybe use a sandpaper to remove the rust (at least a lot of it), and try no to wear where the collar (of the carbon ring) goes.... those two orings should seal that part of the shaft.