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No power at all
- Thread starter Seadoobuddy
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Kev & Tony,
I replaced the Dess last yr with a "used" one. ...I'll check with Nick.
Can the Dess post be tested? can the MPEM be tested without a the buds system?
I assume only dealers have the buds system.
I think I'll keep the oil injection system and not go to pre mix. I'll check all filter external gas filter. In-line was new last Sep't. carb filter probably never. (bogging solution)
Tony, I think the carbs need service, I don't have a pop-off tester nor the knowledge about the springs and stuff. I'll PM you.
I replaced the Dess last yr with a "used" one. ...I'll check with Nick.
Can the Dess post be tested? can the MPEM be tested without a the buds system?
I assume only dealers have the buds system.
I think I'll keep the oil injection system and not go to pre mix. I'll check all filter external gas filter. In-line was new last Sep't. carb filter probably never. (bogging solution)
Tony, I think the carbs need service, I don't have a pop-off tester nor the knowledge about the springs and stuff. I'll PM you.
Tony is right on...if the gauges dont light up when you hit the start button a few times then its further down the line then the post. Check grounds...the 787s main ground is known to rot from the inside and cause all sorts of BS.
JETSKI JUNKIES
New Member
True, those skis are notorious for faulty ground. The DESS is cheap though & they go often. I STRONGLY recommend going premix...
Today I took off the carbs and sent them away to Da'burgh. Also removed the positive and neg cable leading to the starter. I took them to the battery store and they tested them under load and they showed up OK. So I'm thinking maybe it a intermittent problem with the cables. They make new cables and said they would throw in the connectors (repeat customer)...so for about $12 I get 2 new cables on Saturday.
My next thought is that if this isn't the solution then the used post I installed last August is the culprit. So i guess I'll need to go the "new" route on that part. I'm going to test the poster on Saturday and see what's up with it.
If SD wants security then Why can't we just have a key instead of a dess system??????????
My next thought is that if this isn't the solution then the used post I installed last August is the culprit. So i guess I'll need to go the "new" route on that part. I'm going to test the poster on Saturday and see what's up with it.
If SD wants security then Why can't we just have a key instead of a dess system??????????
Here is a post by mtrainer in another thread.....
Mine cranked when jumping the solenoid......makes sense????
This thread is located at:
http://www.seadooforum.com/showthread.php?52518-Solenoid-or-starter-switch&goto=newpost
Here is the message that has just been posted:
***************
Its not your ground. If you had no ground to the starter when you jumped the posts it wouldnt have turned over. I had the same problem. Its either the starter relay or the lanyard switch. If it was the starter switch it self the lights would still have power. On some of these skis the starter relay. Disconnect the switch and get an ohm meter. Hook it up to the wires, with no lanyard it should read open and with the lanyard on it should show some resistance aka ohms. If that checks good its most likely the relay.
***************
Is there a way to test the lanyard?
I know the test for the post.
Mine cranked when jumping the solenoid......makes sense????
This thread is located at:
http://www.seadooforum.com/showthread.php?52518-Solenoid-or-starter-switch&goto=newpost
Here is the message that has just been posted:
***************
Its not your ground. If you had no ground to the starter when you jumped the posts it wouldnt have turned over. I had the same problem. Its either the starter relay or the lanyard switch. If it was the starter switch it self the lights would still have power. On some of these skis the starter relay. Disconnect the switch and get an ohm meter. Hook it up to the wires, with no lanyard it should read open and with the lanyard on it should show some resistance aka ohms. If that checks good its most likely the relay.
***************
Is there a way to test the lanyard?
I know the test for the post.
I know you hate dealers, but I think it's time you took the ski to the dealer and have him put it on the buds system. He'll probably charge you for one hour. You need to find out for sure if its the MPEM because if your gauges are not lighting without the lanyard connected and you've checked all the grounds it's probably the MPEM.
Lou
Lou
Dr Honda
Well-Known Member
I agree. It's a fragile system. Polaris had it right. They used a lock-out system that allowed the user to enter a code on the dash. AND... it could be turned on and off by the user.
Lou, you are right on. Actually yesterday i was gathering all my mechanics info and will call them to see if any has the buds system. The dealer isn't that far away but I'm afraid of the waiting period they might tell me. You would think a simple job could be done while I wait....but never can tell.
With the carbs off, will that present a problem connecting to the buds system.....I wouldn't think so????.
Does anyone know the size of the plastic tube coming off the lower nipple of the elbow of the oil tank. The top one has a 5/16 black hose on it now. I want to buy all new clear plastic tubing for everything but the main line going to the bottom of motor (can't reach that nipple inlet easy)
I found an independent mechanic with a buds system. He said if the ski has no power then a buds won't help to diagnose a problem....IS THAT CORRECT?
He also said, he "thought" the bigger clear hose off the elbow was a 6mm size. I'll take the old hose to compare on Monday.
He also said, he "thought" the bigger clear hose off the elbow was a 6mm size. I'll take the old hose to compare on Monday.
LOU, The one I'm talking about (going to the side of motor, is this the rotary valve line?)is in between the Large one (leading to the bottom) and the one that leads to the injector.
Thanks for the tip of the small injector line (3/32) to be tygon....I'll be visiting my lawn mower place tomorrow
Thanks for the tip of the small injector line (3/32) to be tygon....I'll be visiting my lawn mower place tomorrow
A buddy and myself tested the start/stop switch tonight.....all wires have a "good reading" from the switch to inside the front box.
The post is a different story. We did this test with the lanyard ON and also OFF the post
we touched the black/yellow and the black.....shows good reading on the meter....also tested it to inside the box.
The white/gray wire (post center tip) touched with the black or B/Y showed nothing either way....Also to inside the box......is it suppose to????
I could see if the post was bad then no beeps, but why no gauge lights when stop/start switch is pushed.
I will install the new battery and ground cables tomorrow and test it again.
The post is a different story. We did this test with the lanyard ON and also OFF the post
we touched the black/yellow and the black.....shows good reading on the meter....also tested it to inside the box.
The white/gray wire (post center tip) touched with the black or B/Y showed nothing either way....Also to inside the box......is it suppose to????
I could see if the post was bad then no beeps, but why no gauge lights when stop/start switch is pushed.
I will install the new battery and ground cables tomorrow and test it again.
After installing new ground and new power cable from solenoid to starter and it still didn't work. I started testing ohms and voltage from the battery to everywhere I could. After a few tests I needed a another pair of hands, so I called my neighbor again. He wanted to test voltage from battery to main front box. We found the wire leading to the box from the solenoid. He stuck the leads in and we had power but sometimes not. He pulled the connector apart and found that the female end was larger than it should be so the male pin wasn't making connection all the time. He squeezed it closer together for a nice tight fit so now it beeps everytime and the gauges light up when pressing the start/stop switch....
YEAH the solution was found! ! ! ! ! ! !
Now all I need to do is reinstall the carbs, bled the oil lines, then clean the inside of the hull....again.
Thanks for all the suggestions esp Tony for the tips about all the electrical connections.
I hope I don't need to bring this thread back to life ever again.
YEAH the solution was found! ! ! ! ! ! !
Now all I need to do is reinstall the carbs, bled the oil lines, then clean the inside of the hull....again.
Thanks for all the suggestions esp Tony for the tips about all the electrical connections.
I hope I don't need to bring this thread back to life ever again.
hobojoe
New Member
Seadoo Buddy- what were the colors of the the wires that you found to be troublesome? I'm getting the same thing on my 97 GTI. It started 3 or 4 times today while on trailer. Then all of a sudden- nothing. no lights no beeps no nothing. I've basically done the same troubleshooting as you at this point.
I also, have the exact same problem.
Blew the 15A BATT fuse yesterday, replaced that and it ran fine. Took it to the lake today, NO POWER.
No beep, no juice, no crank, no display, nothing. All fuses are ok. Jumping the 2 solenoid terminals it cranks, so power/ground is good, but nothing else.
Either dead MPEM or maybe same wiring issue you had.
So I ask the same question too, what wires were the ones you found to have the bad connections?
HoboJoe and TheHox,
We started testing from battery to solenoid, then solenoid to MPEM. Luckily it was the first "small" wire we tested, as you know there are hundreds in a ski. Just because i found it, remember it MAY NOT be the same for you.
It was the Red (looks pink now after 16 yrs)/Purple wire from the solenoid leading into the front box. We tested it to make sure we had power to the box. We did and sometimes we didn't. Even though the "slim" plug couldn't be unplugged without really tugging on it. We pulled the rubber covering off and discovered the female end was larger then the male end and wasn't making constant contact with each other. We squeezed the open end a bit tighter and now it clicks when the pin end is inserted.
There are 2 fuses and 19 connections in the front box, not counting all the other connections all over the ski.
Good Luck to both of you.
We started testing from battery to solenoid, then solenoid to MPEM. Luckily it was the first "small" wire we tested, as you know there are hundreds in a ski. Just because i found it, remember it MAY NOT be the same for you.
It was the Red (looks pink now after 16 yrs)/Purple wire from the solenoid leading into the front box. We tested it to make sure we had power to the box. We did and sometimes we didn't. Even though the "slim" plug couldn't be unplugged without really tugging on it. We pulled the rubber covering off and discovered the female end was larger then the male end and wasn't making constant contact with each other. We squeezed the open end a bit tighter and now it clicks when the pin end is inserted.
There are 2 fuses and 19 connections in the front box, not counting all the other connections all over the ski.
Good Luck to both of you.
Took it for test ride today after all was fixed......
What a big PITA it was to reattached the oil pump arm and spring, (http://www.seadooforum.com/showthread.php?53530-oil-pump-spring-location&p=269973#post269973)
but somehow with the help of the Seadoo angels, it fell right into place on about the 5th try. I changed over to a smaller zip tie but they still are a little loose(easy to move). The pump aligned up perfectly the first time. the oil is pumping thought the lines but a little hard to see at times as the Amsoil Interceptor is clear oil. I added some premix for safety for first tank. I also adjusted the throttle so it opens all the way now, about another 1/8 to 1/4 inch more. I think i gained some top end too in the process.
Then I put the flame arrestor back on and soaked it in "Super Clean" and hosed down the inside of the hull....now it's "super Clean".
The new Tell Tale works great, (thanks to Tony for making them).
I wish I could have put it at the chip but that's on a corner.....darn!!!
And again thanks to Tony for checking over the carbs. They were in great shape except for a couple somewhat dirty carb filters, pop-off was in specs too.....now no more bogging going over wakes.
I put it into the lake to test and I believe it's running the best it ever has since I bought it in 2006.
Thanks Guys for the help!!!
What a big PITA it was to reattached the oil pump arm and spring, (http://www.seadooforum.com/showthread.php?53530-oil-pump-spring-location&p=269973#post269973)
but somehow with the help of the Seadoo angels, it fell right into place on about the 5th try. I changed over to a smaller zip tie but they still are a little loose(easy to move). The pump aligned up perfectly the first time. the oil is pumping thought the lines but a little hard to see at times as the Amsoil Interceptor is clear oil. I added some premix for safety for first tank. I also adjusted the throttle so it opens all the way now, about another 1/8 to 1/4 inch more. I think i gained some top end too in the process.
Then I put the flame arrestor back on and soaked it in "Super Clean" and hosed down the inside of the hull....now it's "super Clean".
The new Tell Tale works great, (thanks to Tony for making them).
I wish I could have put it at the chip but that's on a corner.....darn!!!
And again thanks to Tony for checking over the carbs. They were in great shape except for a couple somewhat dirty carb filters, pop-off was in specs too.....now no more bogging going over wakes.
I put it into the lake to test and I believe it's running the best it ever has since I bought it in 2006.
Thanks Guys for the help!!!
Last edited by a moderator:
El Toro 33809
Well-Known Member
Digitally Encoded Security System. It is like a chip key for your car. The ski won't start if it's not the right one.
To go along with El toro's post, the dess is sometimes referred to as the post on which the fob or "key" attaches. it's usually found on the handle bar on GTX's and "dash" on other skis or boats.
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