96 xp 787 no power.

[VDrive Seadoo]

hay guys.so i just bought my first pwc.96 seadoo bombardier xp 787 doesnt run paid $300 dollars. the guy i got it from couldnt tell me anything. except being quoted $1.400 dollars to fix it.so i get it home find the engine is seized. i pull the head and one cylinder had alot of rust the other cylinder in good shape no signs of rust anywhere else so i honed the cylinder checked all bearings in good shape engine turns over by hand easy.so heres my problem not getting any guage activity no power fuses all good battery good. i dont have a lanyrd so i tried touching both contacts on post for lanyard and nothing.i know nothing about thease things can i get some wisdom from u all on electrical systems.
note all the hardware and engine compartment is in mint condition everything looks brandnew.execpt the body
looking forward to learning all i can. thank you

 

[Coastiejoe]

Lets ensure you have a good base engine first. And jumping the lanyard posts will not act the same as if the lanyard is attached as they are programed to wake up the MPEM (Brain). No lanyard or wrong lanyard and it will not power up the MPEM. Which means it will not crank.

First things first. Lets see if it will crank. Follow the red positive wire from the battery to the solenoid. You want to jump across the two large lugs on the solenoid to see if it cranks. If it does, it means that all main connections, battery and starter are good. If not,,, then we need to do some testing.

If it does crank, you NEED to do a compression test so we can see the state of the engine. Post your numbers here and we will go from there...

As I type this, I recall there were some skis around the 96 era that did NOT have an MPEM. Someone will let us know if yours does or does not. Until then, do the solenoid thing and lets see what you get.

 

[nick.bain]

I am fairly sur these skis run an MPEM . The DES post that the lanyard connects to requires a magnet to power the system will give one long beep indercating the key is faulty or incorrect, this will be enough to tell you the mpem is still working.
In the white box that contains the starter solenoid an mpem etc, there you can do most of your testing in regard to the starter circuit, if this all works out you have a couple of options in regards to getting a key for your ski. 1) your local dealer can programme a key for you but good luck with that 2) there is a chap on eBay that sells after market mpems that don't require a key 3) you can purchase you own CANDOO system which will allow you to code keys and conduct diagnostics although this model of ski has very limited diagnostic capability.

Hope this help let's us know how you go.

 

[Matt Braley]

The solenoid is in the rear black electrical box on the 96XP. The front grey box contains the MPEM and you can send it to Minnetonka4me and have a key programmed to it reasonably and quickly. The ebay aftermaket MPEMs will not fit this one.

I agree with Coastie that you should see if your engine is worth saving first. With the internal rust you found I have my doubts.

 

[dannyual767]

Yeah, Matt is right about the black box in the rear near the battery that will house the starter solenoid. While you're in there, look and see if there is water that made it's way in. It happens and it will corrode all of those electrical parts and connections.

Once again, I agree with what Matt and Coastie said about the engine. See if you have proper compression first. It's unlikely that you will but stranger things have happened.

 

[Minnetonka4me]

Hit the start button a few times...it should get the gauges to light up and if the beeper is working it will give you a long beep. If that happens youll need to get a key programmed.

Like Matt said I can program a key for you if you want to send your MPEM up to me. Its the module inside the grey box. You can send the whole box, but shipping is more. A dealer can also do it.

 

[VDrive Seadoo]

hay Dannyual767
thanks for the info,and i checked both boxes for signes of water and there is none all electrical is very clean no blown fuses all seals are in great shape i realy want to take alook at that hour guage because i see very little usage out of this ski.
thanks bud for the help

 

[dannyual767]

VDrive, that's always a good sign when there's no evidence of water in the electrical boxes.

 

[VDrive Seadoo]

a coastiejoe
thanks for the help earlier.so i jumpted the sol.and it turned over nicely and i checked the compression in both cylinders its about 155 each cyl i dont know whats concidered good or bad for pwc and i realy dont know how acurate my tester is.again aside from the rust in the 1 cylinder that engine is pretty dam clean inside,0 carbin buildup all bearings look good all electrical looks real clean in boxes.althow i had an issue come up tonight when i hooked up a battery, i noticed the rear box i think its the coil that the plug wires go to started to get real hot i checked the other componants all felt normal so just the one item that heated up.note theres a wire that comes out of the rear box one black wire with an eyelet on the end i tried both posts on the battery and ended up hooking it up to posative on the battery so #1 whats the wire for and was that the reason the one componant heated up. thanks for your help

 

[nick.bain]

2 black wires come from this box one should go to the negative on the battery and the other goes to the VTS module I have got a schematic if you require.

 

[dannyual767]

That black wire goes to the negative side. I once hooked it up to the positive side and something heated up and I knew it was wrong. Luckily I didn't damage anything and probably neither did you.

It sounds like your compression is good. 155psi is good and even if your compression gauge isn't totally accurate, the fact that both readings are the same is a very good sign. Now all you need is a DESS key so you can try to start the ski.

 

[Minnetonka4me]

Its possible you could have cooked the coil pack so if you have no spark once you get the key programmed...thats the first thing I would check.

As far as hours go...96xp dont have meters. They store it in the MPEM so when the key is programmed you can find out.

Unfortunately...unless the engine Serial and VIN numbers are in the MPEM (Dealer programmed, and not all did their job) you will not know for sure the MPEM or motor are original.

The real question is are the rest of the electronics working...?

 

[VDrive Seadoo]

minnetonka4me
i just had a few questions what is the biggest engine on an xp. what does a gasket kit tipacly cost for a 787and are dealer items for a 96 xp expencive do they have rebuild kits for the bombardier xp 787.how much hp does a stock xp 787 have and what are people doing to boost hp on the 96 xp.sorry for all the questions but again this is my first pwc and i know nuthing about them and need a crash cource
thanks for all ur help.

 

[nick.bain]

i just had a few questions what is the biggest engine on an xp 1998 the XP was release with a 947 and then in 2003 with a 947 DI

What does a gasket kit tipacly cost for a 787and are dealer items for a 96 xp expencive do they have rebuild kits for the bombardier xp I suggest you google 96 xp seadoo manual and do some reading

787.how much hp does a stock xp 787 have probably around 115-120hp

what are people doing to boost hp on the 96 xp What's the point unless you are going to race it. Even if you raise compression tune your carbs or adjust your timing your not going to go any faster without higher RPM which is restricted by the MPEM you would also need to change your impeller. Learn to walk before you run otherwise you are going to melt your engine. If you want to do some mods there is plenty of threads about that on this site.

 

[LouDoo]

i just had a few questions what is the biggest engine on an xp 1998 the XP was release with a 947 and then in 2003 with a 947 DI

What does a gasket kit tipacly cost for a 787and are dealer items for a 96 xp expencive do they have rebuild kits for the bombardier xp I suggest you google 96 xp seadoo manual and do some reading

787.how much hp does a stock xp 787 have probably around 115-120hp

what are people doing to boost hp on the 96 xp What's the point unless you are going to race it. Even if you raise compression tune your carbs or adjust your timing your not going to go any faster without higher RPM which is restricted by the MPEM you would also need to change your impeller. Learn to walk before you run otherwise you are going to melt your engine. If you want to do some mods there is plenty of threads about that on this site.

Nick,

Thanks for posting you said what need to be said, maybe a little blunt. Only one correction, a stock 787 is 110hp.

VDrive, you really need to concentrate on getting your ski running, then worry about the performance issues. There's some great advice in this thread you would do well to follow the advice.

SeaDoo does a great job of getting performance out of these small skis, do the numbers 110hp from a 787cc two cylinder engine, and a 500lb. ski, almost anything you do performance wise will effect engine reliability and engine life.

Also I would suggest that you change your browser to Firefox, it has a built-in spell check.

Lou

 

[dannyual767]

Nick,

Thanks for posting you said what need to be said, maybe a little blunt. Only one correction, a stock 787 is 110hp.

VDrive, you really need to concentrate on getting your ski running, then worry about the performance issues. There's some great advice in this thread you would do well to follow the advice.

SeaDoo does a great job of getting performance out of these small skis, do the numbers 110hp from a 787cc two cylinder engine, and a 500lb. ski, almost anything you do performance wise will effect engine reliability and engine life.

Also I would suggest that you change your browser to Firefox, it has a built-in spell check.

Lou

Amen to that :thumbsup: !

 

[Minnetonka4me]

looks like most of your questions were answered. The 787 is the biggest motor they put in the hull (x-4)you have, although there are many 951 conversions that have been done. The 97+ XPs were 787 in 97, then 947 in 98+ machines. That hull is the parabolic hull.

Seadoo has discontinued many engine parts. Yes when things are available they are expensive. Lots of aftermarket kits out there.

Modding wise...the 787 responds well to a combo of mods. A pipe, cut head, flame arrestors, rev limiter, and rejet kit is what most people do. Then from there a set of bigger carbs.

 

[nick.bain]

Sorry didn't mean to be blunt....