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RESTO 1992 GTX is it worth the engine rebuild/replacement?

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Ron4543

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:Edit: It is a 1993

Hi everyone!

To keep it simple I have had this ski in the garage for a few years. There were some issues starting it when I brought it to FL and I figured it could be a relatively cheap/ easy/fun project. However, due to my heavy workload I was never really able to get far with it. Today I pulled the motor. There is a lot of work that needs to be done inside the hull, new hoses pretty much everywhere, pump needs to be rebuilt, probably need to pick up some used carbs, and plenty of other assorted tasks. I do not have any prior experience working on ski engines, though I do have an owners manual and plenty of motivation.

After pulling the motor I am at a crossroads. I do not know if I should consider rebuilding the motor or just trading in for a core at SBT. If I take on the challenge of getting the ski running, I want to know that it will run for some time. Which is why I feel that at a minimum a rebuild is in order. As I said, I do not have the experience to say which method would suit me best.

Right now I feel like I should not proceed until I get some advice. For now I will just be cleaning the hull inside and out :ack: it's horrendous right now.
 
Ron4543 said:
:Edit: It is a 1993

Hi everyone!

To keep it simple I have had this ski in the garage for a few years. There were some issues starting it when I brought it to FL and I figured it could be a relatively cheap/ easy/fun project. However, due to my heavy workload I was never really able to get far with it. Today I pulled the motor. There is a lot of work that needs to be done inside the hull, new hoses pretty much everywhere, pump needs to be rebuilt, probably need to pick up some used carbs, and plenty of other assorted tasks. I do not have any prior experience working on ski engines, though I do have an owners manual and plenty of motivation.

After pulling the motor I am at a crossroads. I do not know if I should consider rebuilding the motor or just trading in for a core at SBT. If I take on the challenge of getting the ski running, I want to know that it will run for some time. Which is why I feel that at a minimum a rebuild is in order. As I said, I do not have the experience to say which method would suit me best.

Right now I feel like I should not proceed until I get some advice. For now I will just be cleaning the hull inside and out :ack: it's horrendous right now.
Click to expand...

Based on its age, it will likely never be worth what you will put into it in order to get it running. That said, if you are going to keep it with the intention to ride it I would do the SBT engine option. Few can rebuild them more affordable and have some sort of coverage. Being a 2-stroke one of the most important things is the carbs as that is the source of lubrication to the engine. I would send the carbs you have to [MENTION=16022]Dr Honda[/MENTION]. He is honest and straight forward and the prices I have seen him list are VERY fair. This way you will know exactly what you have in regards to carbs.
 
So with the $500 for the core, ~$200 for jet pump and not sure about the carbs from Dr. Honda I should expect about $1000 in total?

Perspective on that is save money and buy a new/used ski.

What if I did not rebuild the engine? I am unsure of it's condition and would not want to waste the money getting everything else in order. My wife and I are looking to buy a house soon so a new purchase on credit is kind of out of the picture at a minimum of next summer. I can use my per diem from work to purchase parts however it will some some time to save up.

I guess other options would be finding a donor ski or selling my hull and trailer too. I got them together for $200. So it wouldn't be a bust on my end.
 
Well I know it's finally moving on toward spring, but right now, at least in our area, there's some pretty nice ski's that can be had in the area of $1200 to $1500. I would suggest something in the mid 90's a 717 or possibly a 787, something easy to maintain and it should also retain it's value at least for a couple of years.

Maybe something like this:

http://huntington.craigslist.org/boa/4319684622.html

You won't find a more maintenance free and a more reliable ski than a 96GTI, I speak from experience.

Lou
 
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LouDoo said:
Well I know it's finally moving on toward spring, but right now, at least in our area, there's some pretty nice ski's that can be had in the area of $1200 to $1500. I would suggest something in the mid 90's a 717 or possibly a 787, something easy to maintain and it should also retain it's value at least for a couple of years.

Maybe something like this:

http://huntington.craigslist.org/boa/4319684622.html

You won't find a more maintenance free and a more reliable ski than a 96GTI, I speak from experience.

Lou
Click to expand...

I couldn't agree more, had one back in the day and loved it.
 
LouDoo said:
Well I know it's finally moving on toward spring, but right now, at least in our area, there's some pretty nice ski's that can be had in the area of $1200 to $1500. I would suggest something in the mid 90's a 717 or possibly a 787, something easy to maintain and it should also retain it's value at least for a couple of years.

Maybe something like this:

http://huntington.craigslist.org/boa/4319684622.html

You won't find a more maintenance free and a more reliable ski than a 96GTI, I speak from experience.

Lou
Click to expand...

I couldn't agree more, had one back in the day and loved it.
 
I'll keep an eye out on local listings for something along those lines.

http://tampa.craigslist.org/pnl/boa/4308747136.html

Maybe I could convince my wife to take a little of our down payment house money to grab up a used ski like that.

Since the motor is out, is there anything I can do to check if it is any good? If I decide to part out the ski or even decide to undertake slowly restoring it I'd like to make sure of the condition.
 
Ron4543 said:
I'll keep an eye out on local listings for something along those lines.

http://tampa.craigslist.org/pnl/boa/4308747136.html

Maybe I could convince my wife to take a little of our down payment house money to grab up a used ski like that.

Since the motor is out, is there anything I can do to check if it is any good? If I decide to part out the ski or even decide to undertake slowly restoring it I'd like to make sure of the condition.
Click to expand...

I'd probably lean towards a new(er) ski, a decent used 717 in the 800-1200 range... follow our classified thread, we post stuff in that range all the time...

but if you want the project...

is this a 587 ? and your in tampa ? (at least SBT is close then)

1st.. maybe the engine is just fine... and it was/is a carb issue.. so don't assume the engine is bad.. just yet...

but if you think your 99% sure your heading towards a new engine.. do the following:

pop the head off, look at the cyl's, and just turn the pto and listen carefully, feel for any resistance. if it seems quiet and the cyl's aren't in bad shape humor yourself further and pull the cyl's and repeat. or crack open the case and do a real inspection of the crank. sbt won't care as long as you save all the parts.

you COULD likely get a decent 587 around the state for $250ish (motor only)....and a complete 587 ski with everything for $350-450.. but for only $500 you get a new motor.. i'd probably go new, but again, to each their own but IMO the warranty is worth $250 since if you fug up the project and blow it again, you can just go back to sbt, and learn from your mistakes on their dime.

fuel line, pump rebuild, carb rebuld aren't that costly, but add up quickly.., especially if added to the cost of an engine, I can't imagine that it would make sense to dump 1K and all that time into that old of a ski, but It just depends on how much free time you have and if you'll enjoy the project.
 
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Spimothy Leary said:
I'd probably lean towards a new(er) ski, a decent used 717 in the 800-1200 range... follow our classified thread, we post stuff in that range all the time...

but if you want the project...

is this a 587 ? and your in tampa ? (at least SBT is close then)

1st.. maybe the engine is just fine... and it was/is a carb issue.. so don't assume the engine is bad.. just yet...

but if you think your 99% sure your heading towards a new engine.. do the following:

pop the head off, look at the cyl's, and just turn the pto and listen carefully, feel for any resistance. if it seems quiet and the cyl's aren't in bad shape humor yourself further and pull the cyl's and repeat. or crack open the case and do a real inspection of the crank. sbt won't care as long as you save all the parts.

you COULD likely get a decent 587 around the state for $250ish (motor only)....and a complete 587 ski with everything for $350-450.. but for only $500 you get a new motor.. i'd probably go new, but again, to each their own but IMO the warranty is worth $250 since if you fug up the project and blow it again, you can just go back to sbt, and learn from your mistakes on their dime.

fuel line, pump rebuild, carb rebuld aren't that costly, but add up quickly.., especially if added to the cost of an engine, I can't imagine that it would make sense to dump 1K and all that time into that old of a ski, but It just depends on how much free time you have and if you'll enjoy the project.
Click to expand...

I've got free time when I am in the office (which is where the ski is). I really am only here just to be present so most of my free time is spent watching movies. I'll take the head off today and get some pictures up. The engines exterior is in pretty rough shape as far as paint goes but I know that doesn't give much of an idea on the internals.
 
Ron4543 said:
I've got free time when I am in the office (which is where the ski is). I really am only here just to be present so most of my free time is spent watching movies. I'll take the head off today and get some pictures up. The engines exterior is in pretty rough shape as far as paint goes but I know that doesn't give much of an idea on the internals.
Click to expand...

need an assistant ? (watching movies not wrenching) lol

honestly, you have nothing to lose, the ski itself has very little value, so at this point, your only out a set of gaskets, and if its a core SBT doesnt' give a dam about them.
 
Spimothy Leary said:
need an assistant ? (watching movies not wrenching) lol

honestly, you have nothing to lose, the ski itself has very little value, so at this point, your only out a set of gaskets, and if its a core SBT doesnt' give a dam about them.
Click to expand...

I turned the crank with the head still on, I only feel the resistance of compression. I don't have a socket to pull the top end cover off so it will probably have to wait until I get back in town since I have to leave Monday.

Movie watching assistants are always welcome!
 
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I found my impeller tool, think I might just go for rebuilding the pump and getting the rest together, I have new spools of hose and new clamps so I think I might just put everything back together slowly. I know these 2 strokes can take a beating and I know that the motor started a few years back and ran with no big issues. I think after rebuilding the pump and carbs I will try to get it water ready. It will certainly take a few months while I get everything together but I've got no other hobbies to put my time towards. I'll keep this updated as time permits.
 
Maybe my old eyes are failing further, but I looked thru this thread a couple times and did not see the big hint: Check compression before going crazy on engine work/replacement. Could be the internals are good and just the externals need clean-up/work. Looks like you checked that the motor turned over easily and smoothly by hand and you felt compression.

Post a couple pictures of the engine/compartment ... we visual learners out here love pictures. You will probably get a lot of hints from the experts.

Having only very old SeaDoos that I am playing with and one of the consistent needs I have found (and confirmed by many posts on this forum) is to go through the entire fuel system and clean it out ... old gas, and especially mixed, will leave a bunch of crud behind starting with the fuel tank and going thru the entire fuel delivery system.

Again, only having experience with the older 580/720 engines, I would recommend at some point after checking initial compression to pull the head. Hopefully all the head bolts come loose, if not be very patient, apply penetrating oil, walk away and try later; if you break one it can be a real PITA ... I have one with 2 bolts broken off by previous owner that I have been working on intermittently for months. My point here being that I have found the head and water jacket seals age and start to leak; cheap insurance to replace. Also a good time to clean out all the sand and stuff that collects in the bottom of the water jacket.

If you have said your prayers every night, you might get this working with rather minimal expense ... then go play.

Rod
 
I've got basically the entire hull cleared out save for the linkages and some electronics. Fuel and oil tank are out to be cleaned. I sprayed it down with some degreaser and going to rinse it out. If I have time before I leave for the week I'll take pictures on Tuesday.

I don't have a tool to check compression anymore so I'd need to go get one, is there a way to check it with the engine out? I though it had to be cranked to test, so I assume it will have to be after I clean up and get everything back together.

I noticed the head bolts are a pain and I'll get the socket for them after soaking in pb. I guess heat could help too.

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk
 
Also, is there a way to check the seals, there was some issue before with a water/oil liquid coming out of the exhaust when it last ran. Granted I only was able to have it run for less than a minute or two and this was 4 or so odd years ago. If not, are they fairly easy to replace? Would hate to get everything back together and have that issue still.
 
You can do compression any time, just put juice to the starter and crank away.

The oil issue is a typical one. They are known to leak internally from the oil bath seals. Most people just ignore it as long as it starts. Some have added a valve on that oil line to keep the pressure off the seals but you have to remember to turn it on every time.

Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk
 
So the oil issue would only leak by enough when not in use? The valve would be only to allow flow while in use? That would save a lot of trouble from going through the seal replacement. I looked up a video of someone hooking up a starter to a battery so do a compression test, pretty simple, thank you so much.
 
Well not much to report on, been really busy out of town. Got the wear ring out, the impeller shaft was really difficult to remove and took about a half hour of heavy wrenching and penetrating spray.

I'm really thinking about buying a media blast cabinet, mostly for automotive parts but it would be good to use on the jet pump and some ski parts. Hopefully I can get a chance to go out and pick up the compression tool tomorrow and I'll post up the numbers.

Also on the list if the compression turns out is all new oil hose and clamps. I figure if I'm going to do the fuel I might as well get it all done.
 
The big oil lines dont need to be replaced....just trim off the old 1/2" and reinstall. Replace the filter, and the little lines.

I dont know if you bought the wear ring already, but I have new OEM in stock, as well as anything else you need for the restoration...those oil lines and and the filter.
 
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