787 Oil Question

[IDoSeaDoo]

Hey guys, I'm sure this was covered somewhere by someone, but my amsoil guy wants another $10 to renew their "membership" for another year (BS) and I'm tired of paying $43/gal for 2-stroke oil anyway. Anyone out think it's ok to use the quicksilver semi-syn oil in a 787? I heard to not use their full synthetic in 787's.

What about the BRP XPS (mineral, not full synthetic)? Is the synthetic factor only to help with the buildup on the raves? If I keep up with cleaning the raves, can I get away with a cheaper API-TC oil?

 

[spx800]

You can use either or. The manual calls for BRP semi-synthetic oil in the 787, so i run the semi-synthetic quicksilver in my spx. I use their full synthetic in my DI.

 

[LouDoo]

I don't know who told you not to use Quicksilver full synthetic, but they're wrong. Quicksilver full synthetic if fine, I understand Walmart doesn't carry it anymore so you will probably need to get it at a Mercury dealer. I also understand that Mystic full synthetic API-TC is another cheaper alternative.

I personally use BRP XPS2 full synthetic API-TC.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/171059995715?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

Also officially synthetic blend is O.K. to use in a 787, but you will be cleaning your Rave's a lot more often.

Lou

 

[AdamXP800]

I thought it called for full synthetic low ash?

 

[spx800]

I thought it called for full synthetic low ash?

For the RFI it says full synthetic. Carb 787 calls for semi.

 

[AdamXP800]

I've always run full synthetic, I switched to mystik pwc oil a while back and have had no issues at all. Raves are never gunked up.

 

[racerxxx]

Not sure if it includes the semi-syn or not but by the sounds of it Quicksilver API-TC will no longer be made if I read that quicksilver post right. I didn't really pay too much attention to it, other then the though to myself of all those guys running out and buying it up cheap and what they will do when they run out? I get it the oil is pricey, but I read all the posts about cheaper oil and all the running around to get it honestly wears me down. If I walk into my dealer they have XPS-II for $52.99, I can buy it from their website for $42.99 or I can get it off Ebay for the $44.99 shipped. If you're comfortable with the price for Amsoil just pony up the $10 and continue. So far every dealer I have looked at online that uses the PSN (powersports network) website lay out has the XPS-II listed at $42.99.

http://www.seadooforum.com/showthread.php?69158-Walmart-discontinuing-Quicksilver-API-TC-oil

 

[racerxxx]

You can use either or. The manual calls for BRP semi-synthetic oil in the 787, so i run the semi-synthetic quicksilver in my spx. I use their full synthetic in my DI.

Here's the placard right on my 96

Sent from my SGH-T889 using Tapatalk

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Full synthetic low ash is the shiz for our hot motors, I doubt there are any bad ones out there anymore.

But, I have to wonder if our motors are using plastic bearing cages that off brand oils might be harsh on. Never know what kind of solvents they might contain for adjusting viscosity, and the oil viscosity surely effects the oil injection calibration to some extent, so where are the specs for that?

Considering all the unanswered questions and the reputation 951's have earned concerning blowing up at the drop of a hat, and the fact that eventually every 2-stroke will seize as it's worn out anyway, for my experiment I'm happily sticking with BRP XPS-II

Maybe it blows up and maybe it doesn't. Hopefully when the day arrives, the spectacle will be adequately documented.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Here's the placard right on my 96

Sent from my SGH-T889 using Tapatalk

I think they revised that spec the very next year when they realized the ash free oil wasn't gonna do the job, right?

 

[racerxxx]

So here is another brand new decal calling out low ash vs ash free. Honestly to me the oil debate make no diff, I roll 5 miles to the dealer and I'm good to go. My Wally doesn't carry any API-TC oils.

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[LouDoo]

I think we've got another dead cat. I'm sticking with BRP XPS 2, full synthetic, low ash, these things are expensive to run what's another couple of dollars for the right oil.

Lou

 

[racerxxx]

I think they revised that spec the very next year when they realized the ash free oil wasn't gonna do the job, right?

Honestly, no clue, I just keep picking up the yellow jug.

 

[racerxxx]

I think we've got another dead cat. I'm sticking with BRP XPS 2, full synthetic, low ash, these things are expensive to run what's another couple of dollars for the right oil.

Lou

Delete if needed

 

[pwgsx]

I just use Amsoil lol, The membership fee pays for itself with 1 order although I use it on my truck and lawn equipment too.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Honestly, no clue, I just keep picking up the yellow jug.

Robert seems to remember the details. I guess your ski has a rare sticker on it there, or maybe we're all dyslexic and have been running the wrong oil?

http://www.sea-doo.net/techarticles/oil/oil.htm

 

[spx800]

going to run the xps from now on since walmart finally sold out of the quick silver.

 

[IDoSeaDoo]

If I remember correctly, WalMart used to carry Quicksilver API-TC, then at some point, they started carrying it AND the Synthetic stuff (black bottle). Was the original jug the Synthetic Blend? I can't find a picture of the synthetic blend that DOESN'T look like the stuff Wally World used to carry always. Either they're using a stock photo on every website on google, or the stuff at Wal Mart has ALWAYS been semi-synthetic. Also, I saw that BRP XPS oil is a mineral oil where as XPS II is synthetic. Didn't seadoo call for XPS in the 787? Is there an XPS that's a synthetic blend too?

Honestly, I just want an oil that I can readily pick up anywhere at a pinch and not pay an arm/leg for. I used to buy up huge quantities of Amsoil, and always find myself scrounging around when I'm out (like last week). I don't have a dealer or anyone selling XPS around me.

 

[spx800]

Our walmart always carried both. The grey bottle is semi and the black bottle is full. They no longer sell either.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Remember, just b/c it's synthetic doesn't mean it's got the ash package we need, if it's rated TCW for outboard motors and it's synthetic or even universal, it's not going into my 951, that's for sure.

Ha, this motor had TCW-3 in it when I took possession and it wasn't damaged yet but it wouldn't wind past 5500 RPM b/c there were some issues so that probably saved it.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Honestly, I just want an oil that I can readily pick up anywhere at a pinch and not pay an arm/leg for. I used to buy up huge quantities of Amsoil, and always find myself scrounging around when I'm out (like last week). I don't have a dealer or anyone selling XPS around me.

Yeah, I get that idea too, but an ash oil in quantity isn't east to find in most places. Order a couple cases and don't forget to reorder. I try to not have more than a year's worth on hand but always keep a couple gallons.

2-stroke dirt bikes need this same oil, and the snowmobiles. They may or may not need the synthetic, and I think if you're willing to clean RAVES the mineral might be okay for the 787 carbed motor as long as it's the right stuff.

I don't even remember ever running a 787 though, so I don't have direct experience or proof you don't need synthetic but the synthetic will definitely take more punishment and of course it's more expensive to manufacture.

The thing about synthetics is they aren't my preference for fogging b/c they don't stay up in the cylinder as well when the surfaces are cold, and synthetics absorb atmospheric moisture. So for fogging, I don't use a synthetic oil.

 

[IDoSeaDoo]

I've always used Amsoil (best oil I could find) in the Challenger when I ran the 787 in it, and that didn't stop it from blowing up all those times... I guess I'm not convinced that the benefit of full synthetic vs semi-synthetic is enough to warrant the extra cost and hassle...

 

[spx800]

Remember, just b/c it's synthetic doesn't mean it's got the ash package we need, if it's rated TCW for outboard motors and it's synthetic or even universal, it's not going into my 951, that's for sure.

Ha, this motor had TCW-3 in it when I took possession and it wasn't damaged yet but it wouldn't wind past 5500 RPM b/c there were some issues so that probably saved it.

These were not their tcw-3 outboard oils. They made them specifically for pwc's that requried low ash api-tc like sea doo.

 

[spx800]

Remember, just b/c it's synthetic doesn't mean it's got the ash package we need, if it's rated TCW for outboard motors and it's synthetic or even universal, it's not going into my 951, that's for sure.

Ha, this motor had TCW-3 in it when I took possession and it wasn't damaged yet but it wouldn't wind past 5500 RPM b/c there were some issues so that probably saved it.

Not sure why this double posted. I'll be switching to xps oil now. I have't had issues with quicksilver; only switching because it's no longer available.

 

[spx800]

I'm not sold on amsoil. There was always controversy on the sled forums i used to frequent and how many motors interceptor caused failures on. Was it the oil? Who knows. As far as i'm concerned i would never use interceptor. Dominator was what was used in race sleds that turned 8500 rpm, but they were torn down and rebuilt at the end of the season.