Seadoo Spark Plugs

[rgardner928]

This is going to be long...

Does anyone know the spark plug model number for a Rotax 717 (a pair of them in a 97 speedster)

So I now have in them NGK BR8ES. But I keep having fowling issues. I use the choke to start and run it close to balls to the wall. But I also do some slow speed riding at times. I keep having one engin, at times stall out when at low speeds, even after riding balls to the wall. And sometimes it never starts again. I'm getting frustrated with this. If I change the plugs, it runs fine again. I use the boat for an hour or two one or 2 days a week. I spend more time on the water fucking with engine stall issues and start or staying started then I do enjoying them. The plugs should last longer then a month before needing to replace plugs again.

So I did some research and learned this,
"NGK indicates the heat range in the middle of the plug number. For example, BCPR6ES-11 has a heat range of 6. (The number after the “-“ is the gap.) NGK plugs are colder the higher the number, hotter the lower the number.

Starting with part # BKR6E-11 (heat range 6),
a colder plug would # BKR7E-11 (heat range 7),
a hotter plug would be # BKR5E-11 (heat range 5)"

Now knowing this a BR7ES would burn hotter than the the ones I have now. I do understand too hot can hurt my pistons, seals and other components (all factory) and burn what's called too lean. But I'm not also not moving to a BR1ES..I'm only going down one, "maybe" two.

I'm thinking about going to the 7 as it's a little hotting and should help with preventing the fowling I'm seeing. I also know earlier engines than my 717 did run with the 7 prior to 8's in them now. So I believe it should handle a one or two digit hotter plug.

I'd still watch my plugs over time to see if I'm getting too lean. But with everything I've said, in theory, wouldn't the 7's help in my situation?

 

[kenfyoozed]

I don't think swapping plugs is going to solve the underlining issue. It may help this issue go away as in masking it, but if your fouling plugs its not the plugs but the fuel and oil. With that being said its mainly the oil that fouls them due to the "dirty" combustion process. So I would start with my fuel and lubrication system. When is the last time the carbs were cleaned? What type of oil are you using? Still on the oil pumps or running premix?

 

[noviceskier]

Last time I was having an issue with plugs fouling I cut the plug wire back about .5cm and replaced the caps. Haven't fouled a plug yet

 

[rgardner928]

Last time I was having an issue with plugs fouling I cut the plug wire back about .5cm and replaced the caps. Haven't fouled a plug yet

New plug wires and caps are less then 6m old

 

[rgardner928]

I don't think swapping plugs is going to solve the underlining issue. It may help this issue go away as in masking it, but if your fouling plugs its not the plugs but the fuel and oil. With that being said its mainly the oil that fouls them due to the "dirty" combustion process. So I would start with my fuel and lubrication system. When is the last time the carbs were cleaned? What type of oil are you using? Still on the oil pumps or running premix?

Carbs including N/S done with genuine Mikuni parts at same time as caps and plug wires, 6m about. Oil is a 2 stroke Bombardier approved Mercury Marine branded oil. Still on oil pumps.

 

[kenfyoozed]

full synthetic api-tc oil? not tw3 correct..... just double checking

 

[noviceskier]

full synthetic api-tc oil? not tw3 correct..... just double checking

you dont need to run fully synthetic on the 720s seadoos mineral oil will do just fine.

 

[kenfyoozed]

I apologize for the wrong info.... I was going off my the manual I have and it list the same oil for the 717 as the 787 "BOMARDIER-ROTAX Injection Oil". I assumed since the 787 took the API-TC so would the 717. I learned something new every day...Thanks

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Yes, the next heat range will foul less often but first it sounds like you have maintenance issues that need addressing. Otherwise you WILL lose an engine.

You're only allowed to use the next heat range AFTER all maintenance issues are exhausted, the tune has been performance modified, and you've completed the entire voo-doo ceremonial dance 12 times including chicken bones, small pebbles and the pin-cushion doll. Shrunken heads are optional and perhaps illegal, so that requirement has been waved in all outer provinces, except sector 11.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

I apologize for the wrong info.... I was going off my the manual I have and it list the same oil for the 717 as the 787 "BOMARDIER-ROTAX Injection Oil". I assumed since the 787 took the API-TC so would the 717. I learned something new every day...Thanks

You will have big trouble with TCW-3 outboard oil if that's what's in there now, you must clean the entire injection system, mixing the wrong TCW-3 and the correct API-TC fills your oil system with jello once the incompatible oils have mixed, they congeal.

You can use either full synthetic API-TC or the mineral version of API-TC in the 717, the 717 doesn't require the superior synthetic version.

 

[mikidymac]

What replacement plug caps did you buy?
If you bought resistor caps and are using resistor plugs you can have too much resistance and limit spark energy? It’s a long shot but not unheard of.

Is your oil pump adjusted correctly? Is your compression low? Have you carbs been rebuilt correctly using only genuine Mikuni parts?

 

[rgardner928]

full synthetic api-tc oil? not tw3 correct..... just double checking

This is the oil I use. It's a purple in color.

 

[rgardner928]

What replacement plug caps did you buy?
If you bought resistor caps and are using resistor plugs you can have too much resistance and limit spark energy? It’s a long shot but not unheard of.

Is your oil pump adjusted correctly? Is your compression low? Have you carbs been rebuilt correctly using only genuine Mikuni parts?

I only use Mikuni parts for my carbs. They were just rebuilt about 6m ago.

Unsure on the oil pump adjustments. Never been touched by me. And unsure about compression level

 

[kenfyoozed]

Oil looks like the proper full synthetic that the 787 uses so it should be more than sufficient for the 717. Just don't mix the two types and you should be fine.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

If you're experiencing abnormal amounts of smoke, could be the return spring of the oil pump lever has broken, or the cable itself has snapped.

 

[JMoser]

Just recently purchased a 2001 SeaDoo Islandia 240 EFI V6. We took it out the first day and noticed we can get 3/4 throttle and it sounds good but as soon as we try to go full throttle we don’t get anymore speed just more noise from the motor... Brought it home and checked the spark plugs, one of the spark plugs was completely clean with nothing on it! Then we found that one of the CDIs wires was broke off so we bought a new one, waiting for it to arrive... Could this be why our spark plug is completely clean and we aren’t getting anymore power from it being full throttle?

 

[mikidymac]

This is the oil I use. It's a purple in color.

The oil pictured in the black bottle is the correct API-TC rated full synthetic and even says not to use it in TCW-3 applications so it is good to use.

The oil in the silver bottle picture is not an API-TC rated oil. Nowhere on the bottle does it say API-TC and just to add to that there is no such thing as a dual rated API-TC and TCW-3 oil. The silver bottle is a JASO rated oil which is a different rating system. So even though I can't say if that oil will hurt your engine I can say that it is not recommended to use in your seadoo engine since it is not API-TC rated.

 

[kenfyoozed]

When i was doing my research on the proper oil i ran across an article that played out what each rating system was and how it could correspond to another. For the life of me I can not find that now.

found it....2 stroke oil

so according to this article the oil exceeds he JASO FD requirements and should be fine...... but please note this is info pulled from the internet, even though its from this forum. I can not recommend this oil but just passing along info.

 

[rgardner928]

When i was doing my research on the proper oil i ran across an article that played out what each rating system was and how it could correspond to another. For the life of me I can not find that now.

found it....2 stroke oil

so according to this article the oil exceeds he JASO FD requirements and should be fine...... but please note this is info pulled from the internet, even though its from this forum. I can not recommend this oil but just passing along info.

The black bottle is made for distribution in dealerships only. Exact same quality product is manufactured in the gray bottle for sale in retail locations. I have spoken to Mercury about this. They said they are the exact same product just branded differently for different sales.

 

[rgardner928]

When i was doing my research on the proper oil i ran across an article that played out what each rating system was and how it could correspond to another. For the life of me I can not find that now.

found it....2 stroke oil

so according to this article the oil exceeds he JASO FD requirements and should be fine...... but please note this is info pulled from the internet, even though its from this forum. I can not recommend this oil but just passing along info.

Thank you for the clarification. Very informative I like all the information and told me. With that being said technically speaking the gray bottles actually better than the Black Bottle then.

 

[JeremyD615]

When i was doing my research on the proper oil i ran across an article that played out what each rating system was and how it could correspond to another. For the life of me I can not find that now.

found it....2 stroke oil

so according to this article the oil exceeds he JASO FD requirements and should be fine...... but please note this is info pulled from the internet, even though its from this forum. I can not recommend this oil but just passing along info.

Keep in mind that JASO ratings for oils measure the lubricity, detergent content, and smoke production, and are a good indicator of oil quality, but do not address the ash content of the oil. Much of the reason for the API-TC requirement from Sea Doo has to do with that ash content. Two stroke oils for watercraft can be broken down into two general categories in that regard, zero-ash oils, which usually carry TCW ratings, and low-ash oils, which generally carry the API-TC rating. Since JASO doesn’t address ash, either one of those types can carry the JASO rating. Most of them will be on the API-TC side of the fence, but not all. There are some products that cross these lines such as the Yamalube 2S, which is a low-ash oil and carries the JASO FC rating, but not API-TC. To be safe, the best thing to do is find a low-ash API-TC rated oil and buy enough to get you through the season. It’s not worth having to rebuild a motor because of either the wrong oil or mixing them and having gelled oil plug your pump.

 

[kenfyoozed]

To be safe, the best thing to do is find a low-ash API-TC rated oil and buy enough to get you through the season. It’s not worth having to rebuild a motor because of either the wrong oil or mixing them and having gelled oil plug your pump.

Agreed.... I'm not using the seadoo oil but did switch to an API-TC oil by Mystik

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Just recently purchased a 2001 SeaDoo Islandia 240 EFI V6. We took it out the first day and noticed we can get 3/4 throttle and it sounds good but as soon as we try to go full throttle we don’t get anymore speed just more noise from the motor... Brought it home and checked the spark plugs, one of the spark plugs was completely clean with nothing on it! Then we found that one of the CDIs wires was broke off so we bought a new one, waiting for it to arrive... Could this be why our spark plug is completely clean and we aren’t getting anymore power from it being full throttle?

Yes, if the CDI wan't firing the spark plug then fuel would solvent-wash the plug insulator clean. Hopefully no damage occurred, and if the cylinder was just not firing and if hadn't run long there's a good change no damage occurred.

But in the case of 2-stroke generally speaking, they easily self-destruct when something's amiss so never just "finish the day and worry about it later" without anticipating an expensive repair.