I have read several post

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Water Crafts
96 Challenger 787 single
#26
Hope someone will see this soon. I'm good with everything but the torque for the collar. I have stuff setting up as we speak! 10 n.m (88lbs.in? I don't get it. So like 7 ft lbs? My book also shows the picture looks like would be on a ski. Not sure about that but mine has the single collar. I think I'm reading into this wrong.
 


Digdog

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Seadoo RXT-X 260
#27
I know it's not 717 but this covers both on this. Now for instance the page before this 717 gets blue Loctite on manifold bolts. 787 gets Loctite 515. That's all it says about bolts and torque specs for the head pipe. It doesn't separate the two. This manual I have is for the year and covers the make of my boat plus the other ones. I'm going to put it back together one more time. Also going to Mark the bolts and watch it like a hawk. If It loosen I'm going to stop and get towed in instead of limping it back. I'm also going to go against the book this time. I'm going to put 515 on the threads. I had three bolts and nuts that I test it. One with 242, another with 248 and last the 515. 242 set in 12 hours could not turn by hand. 515 set in 30 minutes could not turn by hand. 248 24 hours later could still be broke free by hand. The 515 penetrated the threads really nice and even had a good beat at the end. I was really impressed by that. Supposably from what I've read that's why the manifold bolts get torque with that as it doesn't break down as fast. So why not use it on up the pipe? The blues not holding it. I totally agree with you that I have another problem and that counter balance shaft is what I suspect. Just a little insight. I've been turning wrenches for 30 years (not on Seadoo) and I have never ever done something so many times. Usually if I have to repeat something it's because of a defective part. It's been years since that even happened. My Explorer I had with a 717 had the same gasket blow out. I'll loosen the pipe pulled the old gasket out and put the new one in. I tighten the bolts by feel and ran it 3 years before I sold it without any problems. If I can get it through this season I'm going to buy that short block. Well regardless I'm going to get that short block I'll just be down for this season which sucks!
Thread lockers do not work so good in very hot areas because it is the heat that releases the bond. What we always did in the past with sleds where gaskets are is we would run the engine for about 30 mins and then let it cool down and do a re-torque of the bolts, that always seemed to help.
 
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Digdog

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Seadoo RXT-X 260
#28
Hope someone will see this soon. I'm good with everything but the torque for the collar. I have stuff setting up as we speak! 10 n.m (88lbs.in? I don't get it. So like 7 ft lbs? My book also shows the picture looks like would be on a ski. Not sure about that but mine has the single collar. I think I'm reading into this wrong.
I usually tighten until you feel the bolt stop turning, carefully of course!
 

mikidymac

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#29
What collar are you talking about?

Use the thread lock and sealants listed in the manual.
 
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Water Crafts
96 Challenger 787 single
#30
I'm talking about the stainless steel ring that locks the two purple pipes together. Where the round copper ring is. The torque I am looking for is for that lock nut.
 

mikidymac

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#31
Then yes, it's only 88 inch pounds. For the copper seal use Permatex Ultra Copper RTV on it.
 
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Location
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96 Challenger 787 single
#33
Update: took boat out about 5 times watching it like a hawk. Got comfortable and bolted the hood back on. Just noticed the compartment was wet and I had power loss. The manifold come loose, the two grommets on the side of the engine and bolts come out and broke another head pipe!!!! I did it by the book with all the correct Loctite. I'm over this!
 

GGuillot

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1996 GSX
#34
Did you ever tear into the engine and check the crank and balance shaft alignment/condition? All the loctite and proper torque in the world is not going to solve it. If the engine keeps coming apart and breaking pipes in the process you have some serious vibration causing it. Only pulling the engine and doing a through blueprint examination on the bottom end is going to fix it.
 
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Location
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96 Challenger 787 single
#35
No I didn't. I got the motoseal and all. I did find that I had to cut the plug wires back. It helped a lot and actually seemed good. Got rid of a little skip and a lot of vibration. But I guess it's time to pull it apart. The reason I didn't was it appear to have never been split. Looking at the paint missing on some of the old seal I don't think the bottom end was taken apart. Top and definitely was. It was one over and the paint didn't match. Still something must be messed up.
 

GGuillot

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1996 GSX
#38
Finally removed engine and pulled bottom. Did I find my problem? Also no oil in that counter balance shaft compartment. Maybe this is why my exhaust keeps vibrating apart!???
Yes, that'd do it, looks like the crank and balance shaft are not aligned. That 2nd pic really tells the story, there's no mark on the crankshaft lining up with the balance shaft. It's considered normal for the cavity to not have oil in it, only is there for initial start up after a new engine rebuild.

I'd say it's virtually impossible to have it jump without stripping, so did you have a rebuild prior to the vibration issue?
 
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Location
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96 Challenger 787 single
#40
Previous owner said it was rebuilt. So I'm guessing completely. As far as the timing marks. Not even close! Would I want that sell seal push towards the back near the crank or towards the outside of the case? Also I thought seals couldn't be replaced without a crank rebuild.? Looks to me I can replace both outer seals.
 

GGuillot

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1996 GSX
#41
Previous owner said it was rebuilt. So I'm guessing completely. As far as the timing marks. Not even close! Would I want that sell seal push towards the back near the crank or towards the outside of the case? Also I thought seals couldn't be replaced without a crank rebuild.? Looks to me I can replace both outer seals.
Just lift the balance shaft up out the case then reinstall and align it, post a pic afterward if you want verification.

No need to pull the crankshaft out and mess with the seals unless you were having a vacuum or oil leak.
 

mikidymac

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#42
From your picture that crank is shot. THe bearings are pitted and have maks in them not to mention the balancer should not be black and nasty like that.

The area should never be dry and the oil isn't just for start up, those bearings and gears need lube to survive.
 

dieselndoo

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#43
Good call, Chester..
If your not comfortable rebuilding it yourself, just go with the shortblock. Sometimes, i get cranks with no balance marks. Them are fun to do
 
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Location
Staunton, VA
Water Crafts
96 Challenger 787 single
#44
I'm going with a short block. The bearings have rust on seal side and there is pitting on rotary valve shaft as well. The engine bay was submerged before I purchased. I guess whoever "rebuilt" the engine did the bare minimum. Still always amazed at what I find when you pull something apart.
 

Chester

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98 SXi Pro
#46
Finally removed engine and pulled bottom. Did I find my problem? Also no oil in that counter balance shaft compartment. Maybe this is why my exhaust keeps vibrating apart!???
We solved this problem over 3 months ago for you. When you ask for advice here, maybe you should follow it? Just saying.

Chester
 
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Location
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Water Crafts
96 Challenger 787 single
#47
Chester what can I say. Your right! Just didn't understand why it ran the first whole season without vibrating apart. Guess I was just second-guessing my work. Am I using enough Loctite, too much, that Harbor Freight torque wrench you know. Did take a look and they had it looks like exactly 180° out. Thanks for everyone's help!!
 

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