96 XP launch problems and squealing

[griffith1230]

Hello Friends:

Let me start by saying that I am new to Seadoo Forum. I would appreciate any help you all can give me as a novice.

I purchased a 1996 Sea-Doo XP with a 787 from a family member. Turns out it had major issues. Last year, we realized it needed a new engine and bought one from SBT in Florida. While putting it in, we must have tightened the oil pump a bit too tight and caused a hairline crack to appear in one of the "ears" on the pump. New fuel lines were in throughout, new starter, new battery.

Took it to the lake for a spin. At first, it did great, but I noticed a problem a bit on take-off. I am not sure if this is what you all describe as "cavitation." As I rode it through the week it became progressively worse. RPM would jump right off, but the ski would sit still with no takeoff for several seconds. Finally, it was like someone would take their foot off the clutch and it would go.

I spoke to SBT's tech and he suggested that this may be a problem with the wear ring. Do you agree?

Second, when I was at top RPM's, I noticed a high pitch squeal. It got progressively worse on the last of five days at the lake. By the final day, It was squealing almost the entire time the throttle was engaged.

Could this be related to the fuel pump failing? I am inclined to spend $15 to block off and just mix the oil/gas myself.

I am a family man with limited funds and cannot afford to take to the dealer. I have spent too much to turn back now. Please help!

Jacob
Temple, GA

 

[cyaman37]

Yes I would say you have a cavitation problem,it could be the wear ring or carbon ring. The squealing could also be coming from the pump bearings. Have you serviced the pump/checked the oil in it?


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[griffith1230]

Cyaman:

I am not sure what the carbon ring is, but I am familiar (because of what I have read) with the wear ring. I have a manual if you could tell me where to look about a carbon ring. As for service, I haven't ridden but once since the rebuild. I just pulled off the steering mechanism, and the cone. The o-ring on the cone was pinched and obviously not sealed properly. Inside the cone was lots of gunk, no real lubrication. I have cleaned it out.

What next? Thank you so much for your advice. Trying to fix it cheap... we shall see.

Jacob

 

[Coastiejoe]

Hello Friends:

Let me start by saying that I am new to Seadoo Forum. I would appreciate any help you all can give me as a novice.

I purchased a 1996 Sea-Doo XP with a 787 from a family member. Turns out it had major issues. Last year, we realized it needed a new engine and bought one from SBT in Florida. While putting it in, we must have tightened the oil pump a bit too tight and caused a hairline crack to appear in one of the "ears" on the pump. New fuel lines were in throughout, new starter, new battery.

Took it to the lake for a spin. At first, it did great, but I noticed a problem a bit on take-off. I am not sure if this is what you all describe as "cavitation." As I rode it through the week it became progressively worse. RPM would jump right off, but the ski would sit still with no takeoff for several seconds. Finally, it was like someone would take their foot off the clutch and it would go.

I spoke to SBT's tech and he suggested that this may be a problem with the wear ring. Do you agree?

Second, when I was at top RPM's, I noticed a high pitch squeal. It got progressively worse on the last of five days at the lake. By the final day, It was squealing almost the entire time the throttle was engaged.

Could this be related to the fuel pump failing? I am inclined to spend $15 to block off and just mix the oil/gas myself.

I am a family man with limited funds and cannot afford to take to the dealer. I have spent too much to turn back now. Please help!

Jacob
Temple, GA

First, Welcome aboard.. There are a GREAT many here with extensive 2-stroke knowledge as well as specific ski knowledge. You came to the right place..

Second, as this is a 2-stroke ski and question, I will move this post to the 2-stroke forum and leave a 30 day-redirect so you can easily find it until you learn the forum better.

Third, greatest percentage of odds is a cavitation issue. To describe cavitation, I find it best to you the automotive world. It is much like flooring the pedal and the tires spin in place. The engine RPM's go up but you really don't move forward with good performance. This is what is happening to your impeller. Think of your impeller as the spinning tires. Due to the wear ring being worn or the impeller being damaged you can't get traction. Thus,,, it spins for a bit until it can grab some water to get you moving.

There is a chance that the spline on the drive shaft is bad. If so, the engine revs up but the load on the impeller cause the splines to slip. Bu tin most cases, it is an impeller/wear ring issue.

Take a look at the impeller area. The gap should be no larger from the wear ring to the impeller than the thickness of a dime...

 

[griffith1230]

Is it possible that we did something wrong when installing the new motor that would have caused damage to the drive shaft? There is some gap between the edge of the impeller and the wear ring, but it doesn't seem to me to be as large as most would describe.

Also, what do you think about the squealing?

Best to block off rather than replace a costly oil pump at this point?

 

[Coastiejoe]

Is it possible that we did something wrong when installing the new motor that would have caused damage to the drive shaft? There is some gap between the edge of the impeller and the wear ring, but it doesn't seem to me to be as large as most would describe.

Also, what do you think about the squealing?

Best to block off rather than replace a costly oil pump at this point?

Many do the block off thing. There are pros and cons. Let someone with specific knowledge advise you on that one. I know just enough to be dangerous,,,

Squealing could be from the impeller area and or it is the drive shaft spinning within itself (defective slines) and making the noise. If it were mine, I would pull the pump and take a look at the splines and the impeller area as a whole.

Did you use an alignment tool when installing the replacement motor? This is a very important part of a proper install. More on that later if you didn't.

 

[griffith1230]

No we did not....that could be the problem..??

 

[FinnExplorer]

You said that when you took cone off gunk came out. So the oil in jet pump could have been contaminated with water and trashed the bearings, so the squealing noise. If you spin the impeller does it turn smoothly?

 

[griffith1230]

I turned it with a wrench on the end of the shaft. It did turn, but I wouldn't describe it as "turning freely." it has a compression feel to it (with a bit of rough grit feel in it).

 

[Coastiejoe]

I turned it with a wrench on the end of the shaft. It did turn, but I wouldn't describe it as "turning freely." it has a compression feel to it (with a bit of rough grit feel in it).

Is the engine turning over? If not, then just the drive shaft is and the splines are wiped out. That would explain "grinding" noise.


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[griffith1230]

The engine is not freely turning over. The drive shaft I can feel turning and I feel a clicking feeling when it is turning. When I pulled plugs, it would turn but not with any sort of compression. Is this the end for the 96 XP?

 

[Coastiejoe]

The engine is not freely turning over. The drive shaft I can feel turning and I feel a clicking feeling when it is turning. When I pulled plugs, it would turn but not with any sort of compression. Is this the end for the 96 XP?

No,,, but I want to be VERY CLEAR so that we give you good and accurate advice.

When you use the wrench, you said the engine does not freely turn over. That makes sense no matter what as it may be the compression of the engine you are feeling. So,,, if you turn the drive shaft with a wrench, does the engine turn over on the same ratio, as in 1 to 1. If not, it is likely the drive shaft as they are known to fail. I would pull a spark plug and stuff some line into the cylinder and then do your wrench test again. The line (cord) will NOT allow the engine to crank over once the piston hits the line. Once it hits the line you should NOT be able to turn the drive shaft. If you can keep turning it and the engine is not turning, then you need a drive shaft.

 

[blairwill4]

Is it possible that we did something wrong when installing the new motor that would have caused damage to the drive shaft? There is some gap between the edge of the impeller and the wear ring, but it doesn't seem to me to be as large as most would describe.

Also, what do you think about the squealing?

Best to block off rather than replace a costly oil pump at this point?

I will always be an advocate against the block off kits. When your ski is running at idle it mixes oil to gas roughly 100 parts gas to 1 part oil. When you are full throttle it is close to 35 to 1. When you mix it in the tank you want to mix it at 35 or 40 to 1 so that way when you do hammer on it you can have the right amount of oil. But anytime you are not a full throttle you are using more oil than is needed and basically just wasting money. Also make sure to use full synthetic oil in that ski. I recomend the seadoo brand it works great and can be found on ebay or any dealership. THe cheapest I've ever found it is 40$ a gallon. At that price no need to be wasting your oil. Stick with the oil pump.

Two things to check on the oil injection. First, on the pump there are two notches. make sure those are line up when you dont have the throttle down. They are a little hard to see with the whole ski put together, so just take your smart phone, put it on camera mode with the light on, and take a video of everything down there and you can watch it and see if its lined up. Second thing to check is to hammer the throttle, then immediatly shut the ski off. Its best to do this when you can just float to shore. Then pull your plugs and look at them. You want them to be a nice chocolate brown. If they are black and or wet, its running too rich. If they are great or white you are running lean.

 

[Jetskigoodies]

With you describing the cone having no oil but gunk in it I would say that your pump may need a rebuild. This would also cause your squeling sound and the cavitation. You probably need to rebuild the pump and also may need a new wear ring. For about $300 you should be find someone local to rebuild your pump install the wear ring and align the motor. You really want it aligned as well. The drive shaft should be as staight as possible and you need an alignment tool for that.


There are many threads on how to rebuild your pump and how to replace a wear ring. If you want to do it your self you could save about $150-$200





http://www.shopsbt.com/seadoo-jet-ski-jet-pump-rebuild-kit/72-105.htm

Wear ring is between $40-$80 depending on brand.

[video=youtube;6827Gnoj-eA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6827Gnoj-eA[/video]