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2000 GTI carb making me crazy

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masdbo

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Ok, I thought I knew a little something but am starting to wonder...... my 717 with single carb runs great, until you get on the gas and just about the time it plains out, it sounds fuel starved. Pull out the choke and it will run great.

Background......
1. rebuilt the carb and may have used the wrong spring for the needle valve....
2. Had this carb on and off 20 times in the last week....... the little filter in the carb is clean.
3. I played with adj the lever for the float valve several times, each time it got better each time I bent up the lever a little, then got to the point where it would load up at idle again.
4. I have original grey lines......(but little filter not getting dirty)
5. Tonight I put on a spare carb off another ski, (checked the little filter before I put it on)..... it ran great, but same fuel starve prob..... runs 50mph with choke pulled though!
6. Bowl fuel filter is clean

At this point I am thinking lack of pulse for the fuel pump? Or What?????
 
Ok, pulling the choke limits air flow, so it sounds like fuel starvation to me. Regardless of how good the fuel lines appear to you, until they are removed, there is no point in any other trouble shooting. Find the original spring from the carb before the rebuild an put it in. Be sure you did not lose the clear plastic tiny piece in the carb. Clean the pulse side carefully and replace the pulse hose. Read the tech section of the main page. Verify your pop off pressure is not greater than 30 psi.
 
You need to get back to basics, verify that your pop off is correct, set carb to spec, and see how that works. Then you can richen up the low and high speed mixture if needed. That is assuming that you put the carb back together correctly. I do not think your problem has anything to do with the pulse line.
 
Ok, I will change the fuel lines, just thought that if they were breaking down I would see something in the filter.... As far as the carb, it is back together properly and remember, I put on another carb.... same problem. That would lead me to think something other than the carb. But the pop off obviously is not right.

Do the lines colapse on themselves or just decompose and clog the filter...?
 
Replace those grey fuel lines, when you get the carb. right, all your work is going to be for nothing if you don't replace the gas lines.

Lou
 
Clean the fuel selector also, it may be restricting the flow right there. And check the little water separator filter. Sometimes they get varnished up with old gas and do not flow enough fuel at higher RPM.
 
Just do a google search on Seadoo grey tempo fuel lines. Then you will see why you MUST change these or you'll be in the market for a new engine. You can clean those carbs 100 times but until you change those lines/fuel selector it is all for nothing, a waists of time
 
Pressure check your fuel lines, make sure you're not sucking air. The other suggestions are sound.

Otherwise, could be the transition ports aren't flowing properly. Be sure to clean these by shooting liberal amounts of carb cleaner through low speed jet.

Assuming everything is confirmed correct, such as fuel pressure and the fuel system has no leaks, I often find a mid range lean bog is due to stubborn gum deposits in the transition ports.

On my boat after checking and cleaning everything, I actually had to increase my low speed jets size in order to eliminate the nagging mid range lean bog in my 951 dual carb.
 
masdbo said:
Ok, I will change the fuel lines, just thought that if they were breaking down I would see something in the filter.... As far as the carb, it is back together properly and remember, I put on another carb.... same problem. That would lead me to think something other than the carb. But the pop off obviously is not right.

Do the lines colapse on themselves or just decompose and clog the filter...?
Click to expand...

I'll show how my 97 GTI looked:
IMG_0690.jpgIMG_0692.jpgIMG_0689.jpg
 
And I would add an inline filter somewhere before the carb where you can see it and reach it...Fram G2 works.
 
how about a cracked pickup in the tank?could pull a slight amt of fuel,for idle,but not enough for prolonged throttle opening,,
 
donkey said:
how about a cracked pickup in the tank?could pull a slight amt of fuel,for idle,but not enough for prolonged throttle opening,,
Click to expand...

I believe the tank has Dual pickups , one for reserve and the other is for on position so switching the fuel selector valve would change it if the pickup tube was cracked
 
Thanks, I did have a problem with the fuel selector a few years ago, would die when I went to reserve. It was completely clogged up. It is good now. I will change those fuel lines today. I have had some of that green goop in the lines, but hasn't made it to the carb in the last few years. (looking at the enternal filter)....That will eliminate that and possible air leak in the system. Remember, it will run ok at top end if I bend the needle valve lever out a little, just loads up at low speed and will flow into the engine after shutting off making it hard to start.

As far as finding the original spring, it's long gone. I will build a pop tester using the post I found on here and get that set right.
 
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"just loads up at low speed"

I thought it was running out of fuel (lean)?

The cracked fuel pickup idea(or something similar is possible, eliminate by switching to reserve or maybe running a full tank.

Sure there's sufficient fuel in the tank? I thought this might be the case with mine but a full tank didn't help.

I actually used clear fuel line and an electric pump to pump fuel from the tank to make sure I wasn't sucking air into the fuel line. Found nothing, but noticed if the fuel cup wasn't tight, it would suck air from there.

On the G2 filters, I once had very small and large corrosion particles in an aluminum tank with a G2 filter and although the filter caught most of it(tons), some still made it through into another very fine glass tubed filter with nylon screen in the line just before the carb. I finally went with a marine spin-on type water filter-separator that looks like an automobile oil filter. Nothing makes it through those but fuel.
 
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Yea Sportster, It loads up and runs rough then stalls while idling...(When I have bent the needle valve actuator out of the correct range in an attempt to make it run right. At that point it will run correctly WOT. Bend it back down to level with the carb body as spec in the manual and it runs great, (low speed) but does not pass enought fuel to run at WOT or half throttle.

I have a roll of fuel line, just to get that out of the way. Also, I have checked the bowl filter many times, and it is always pretty clean. I am careful to get it spun on right. Maybe that gray fuel line is sucking air somewhere.

It is telling that it is doing the same thing with two different carbs.
 
Okay, so what I think I'm hearing is the low end works fine if pop-off is set correctly, but upper end it runs out of fuel.

But, if pop-off is set really low, it floods out at low end and can run at the upper end.

Assuming fuel volume and pressure are sufficient(as in fuel system is operating correctly), pop-off has a minimal effect at upper end. If fuel volume and pressure are lacking(sucking air can be the cause), a really low pop-off might open the fuel metering valve enough to mask the problem. Problem is, the low end is likely to choke on the excess fuel due to low pop-off (the real life fact is, pop-off is what keeps low end from choking and loading up on too much fuel).

So, there must be something wrong(outside the carbs) with the fuel delivery. Could be on either side of the carbs. I suggest going back to the correct pop-off setup and then search for and resolve any fuel system delivery issues. Make sure the flow restrictor is still in the return line, if not built into the carbs, as some are. I believe some setups don't have return line restrictors built into the carbs, the restrictor orifice is actually installed in the original factory fuel line. So it's possible when replacing the fuel lines, to overlook and accidentally eliminate the return line restrictor(s). I don't know what that orifice size should be, but as a test, the return line could be pinched in order to simulate the return fuel restriction.

I guess what I'm saying is, if the fuel pump is A-okay, and the suction side of the fuel lines are leak free, and good fuel flow is confirmed, and the entire delivery side is in good functional condition in all aspects including the fuel pump itself (fuel pump pulse line has strong pulse signal, too), then a low fuel delivery volume/pressure issue could be a result of too much fuel being returned to the tank, ie: not enough fuel pressure. A missing return orifice might be the cause, check your garbage can for old fuel lines with restrictor fittings that may have been removed accidentally? Are fuel return restrictors shown in the diagram, or parts bill of materials?

Of course if this is a case where this issue developed by itself as opposed to having showed up after servicing the fuel system, then the orifice restrictor idea likely isn't the solution.

My two BNI46 carbs on the 951 have thse built-in return fuel restrictors, and I'm sure without those would also go flat on the top end due to lack of fuel pressure.

And, make sure those two valves in the fuel pump are sealing properly, too.

Just thinking out load, carry on.....
 
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Sound like a lean condition. You've had this carb off 20 times - do you have a new carb base gasket on there? How about the O-ring on the fuel bowl? Careful playing with that needle arm. If it's too high, it will open the needle when you screw down the carburetor cover. This will literally fill your motor up with fuel and prevent you from turning over (hydrolock). I'm not sure if this problem can be witnessed on the trailer, but you can eliminate all of your lines as the culprit by running the ski on a separate hose stuck into a can of gas. Doing this on the water would be rather tricky and dangerous, so do at your own risk. Good luck!
 
The green goo in my pics was never visible in the stick filter as all of it was after the filter. And, just because the internal filters look good dies not mean none of this stuff passed through them. It could be in the ports again where you can't see the gook. I'm not saying this "is" the problem but if the gray lines were ever attached to a clean carb, them you have to start over to be sure.
 
Thanks for all the advice, I was definitely getting frustrated. I changed all the fuel lines and in doing so when I got to the fuel separator I decided to blow on the lines to see if it was sealing...... It looked good, screwed all the way up, but when I blew air in it leaked easily. I think the threads were a little worn because no matter how tight you got it it would not seal, then it would pop loose. I know several of you mentioned this......!

I finished up the fuel lines and took her for a test ride and it ran perfectly. The carb I am using is the spare with the proper set up for the pop off. If I put the original back on and set the pop off, I have no doubt it will work also.
Thanks Again!
 
Glad you found it. Air leaks can be a bear to find. I took my valves off and decided it was too far gone and replaced them. Hit the water man!
 
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