Suddenly, 1996 GTX won't crank. Was running great.

[Mlandel]

Put a new engine in my 1996 GTX at the beginning of summer and it has been running great all summer.
Sat for a week, and now won't crank over. Battery is fine and terminals are good and clean.
Lights come on when DSS key is attached. Overheat light flashes and other lights go our when start button is pressed.
Buzzer hasn't worked since I got it. In the past I replaced the starter relay and the start button, as they were flakey.
All summer it has been terrific, although it did cut out once while running as though the key had been removed.
Hope someone can give me a run down of things to try.
I know that I should jump the starter to see if it cranks. What else and in what order?
What are the odds that it's a fuse, and if it is a fuse, how do I find the root cause?

Thanks ahead of time to all of you. You all have been a terrific resource in getting and keeping this thing running.

 

[POPPS]

When you say won't crank, do you mean the starter turns the motor, but it will not fire, or do you mean the starter will not engage? For it to suddenly die, it could be a connection, dess post dying, even the front trigger coil gone.

 

[Mlandel]

The starter does not try to engage at all. No spin. I don't hear the starter relay. I am going to check the 15A fuse in the rear box today.

 

[Mlandel]

How do you test the DSS post?

 

[j.harris]

I think you should remove the PTO cover and spark plugs then try to turn the engine over by hand. In a lot of situations not being able to crank the engine after sitting means it is getting filled with oil.

Be warned, if you pull the plugs and use the starter to crank the engine oil will shoot out and make a huge mess. When turning by hand go slow and be prepared for oil to come out of the cylinder.

 

[Mlandel]

Engine turns fine by hand. Starter does not attempt to turn the engine.

 

[POPPS]

Okay, jump the relay,,,to rule out the relay

 

[Mlandel]

Fuses in the rear box are good. Jumping the starter side of the relay turns the starter.

 

[Mlandel]

Ground from the coil to the battery is good. Is the starter relay triggered by 12V? I don’t want to fry anything while testing the relay. Front box clicks when the DSS is installed. Lights and clicks happen when the starter button is depressed. Other than feeding 12V to the starter relay, what is next to try?

 

[street]

Having same issue with 1996 GTX I bought a few weeks ago. Ran fine until it wouldn't start anymore. I can start a new thread (don't want to hijack) but figured this was almost the same thing here being asked and same year. Let me know the preferred way or if we can help each other in one thread.
Battery was made 2/20 and I charged it, says 12.8v. I tested the selonoid and not sure if it was working since it just clicked once when start button pressed. I shorted with screwdriver and nothing. The guy who sold it happened to have a new relay (selonoid) and one was replaced in 2018 according to service records, so I just replaced that anyway. No idea how long they last but why not to rule it out. Still just a click. Short does nothing so I suspect starter. Thing is, he gave me a new one of those also. I took airbox the housing off the side and found the starter under, took off red cable and put on new starter and set it off to side. I get 12.6v to that cable end when I press start but it doesn't spin. I put it all back together and cleaned all wires up. Only ones that look a bit corrupted were on the ignition coil I think it is next to the relay. Anyway, I didn't realize I have to ground the starter until more research. Is that why the new starter didn't fire or is it possible a ground or another thing to look for. The one fuse was good back in that box also. I didn't want to replace the starter before knowing it was bad. Should I try again with the new one and grounding it or is there a way to hook jumper cables to another battery directly to the installed starter to see if it fires while bypassing that whole relay thing or will that fry something? Thanks! Again, if this needs to be it's own thread that is fine. OP sounds like he hasn't tried some of the things I had.

 

[POPPS]

When you have the starter to the side, you must ground the starter to complete the circuit....is the starter after market?,,,they fail quickly.

 

[street]

When you have the starter to the side, you must ground the starter to complete the circuit....is the starter after market?,,,they fail quickly.

The starter he gave me was from Amazon so I assume so. One of the bolts that stick out the back is badly bent. Didn't think much of it but if it required to be straight for mounting or the ground I may not be able to bend it back to thread a nut on. The question I had before trying that again is can you hook up a jumper cable to the red line bolt on side and a ground to try to start it while still hooked up to engine to rule out if the starter is bad? I have no idea if my spare deep cycle battery would surge something that way or if it is safe to try it.

 

[street]

Another quick question, does the 96 GTX have a ground wire leading to starter or does it just ground by touching the engine? I wanted to test my grounds also before ripping the old one out if that is a possible culprit. Thanks

 

[POPPS]

With the starter installed, you can take a positive cable jumper and connect it to the positive terminal on the starter. The same can be accomplished at the selenoid terminal. Make sure you have the key on the dess post because it completes the ignition circuit to the coil.

 

[street]

With the starter installed, you can take a positive cable jumper and connect it to the positive terminal on the starter. The same can be accomplished at the selenoid terminal. Make sure you have the key on the dess post because it completes the ignition circuit to the coil.

I assume I need to ground it also with the negative jumper or do I put that negative from battery on the engine somewhere to ground since I don't think the ground location matters but I'm new to this? Not sure why you would need the key in since I would be testing with an outside battery to ensure it isn't anything in the electrical system that is the cause of the issue and not just a bad starter. If I eliminate variables, it will find the cause.

 

[POPPS]

Sorry,,,ground of jumper on the battery or any metal of motor as long as the motor ground at the starter is connected to the battery,,, if you are not trying to start it, you do not need the key on the dess post....if I understand correctly, you have an after market starter, therefore you are going to have issues, they rarely work.

 

[street]

Sorry,,,ground of jumper on the battery or any metal of motor as long as the motor ground at the starter is connected to the battery,,, if you are not trying to start it, you do not need the key on the dess post....if I understand correctly, you have an after market starter, therefore you are going to have issues, they rarely work.

Yeah, what I was saying is for testing the existing, installed starter. Bypassing with direct positive current to the red terminal and a ground. Shouldn't require the key since I'm trying to bypass the relays and electrical to isolate if the starter is any good before working backwards. Again, I already replaced the solenoid, so it can't be that unless something blew it when I hooked it up. If I get nothing when I hook directly to another battery then I will assume starter is bad. If starter works then it has to be a connection or electrical. If I also take the existing cables and hook to the new starter before it is mounted, that would require the key. Sounds correct?

I just didn't want to blow the old starter if running a direct battery connection to it would cause any surge damage or something.

 

[street]

Well I never heard back if it would damage it so rolled the dice. I disconnected battery and hooked up second battery via jumper cables to the existing, installed starter and a ground. Got nothing. So took that out. The low front bolt was sticking out about an inch, totally loose. The back bolt was loose as well. Got it out and hooked new one up to the red wire and used jumper to go to back bolt and grounded on engine metal. Pressed start and it spun. So now I knew it was OK electrical and juat bad starter. Replaced it and started right up. The old starter had a date of 2019. That means the relay and the starter were both only a year old, which concerns me. Not sure what would cause those to go so quick. Thanks all.

 

[Mlandel]

Regarding the original post. Issue was traced to a pinched wire in the front electrical box. Debugged by putting an led on the (dead) buzzer line and noted that it was having DSS wiring issues. Found a tightly bent wire that when straightened, fixed the issue. I'll have to replace that over the winter, but it is working now. Thanks all for the assistance both here and in the messages.