new 951 di engine needs to be primed/bleed but HOW?

[68ragtop]

More than likely you have a sensor issue if the maint warning comes on right after you install the lanyard. But, if you didn't already, it might be worth trying a reset. your ski has a timer that also triggers a maint warning every 25ish hours? install the key & hold the reset for 2 seconds. That clears that warning. That would be a bit ironic if the ski was had no light before the rebuild, but its possible. otherwise most of the other sensors will very possibly trigger the 4K limp mode.

here's a list of what will & won't trigger limp mode.

 

[ricardo1]

This is what my oil lines look like, no bueno..

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[68ragtop]

Its very normal to get air in the lines when you first bleed out the system. There are places in the pump & possibly in the filter that pockets of air can get trapped. As long as all the pockets of air & oil are moving away from the pump & into the engine when running, its probably fine. they should however speed way up when you manually turn the oil pump open at running idle, if so, you should be fine. Just double check after that the cable is still connected & the pump is still opening with the throttle afterwards.

That being said, these air pockets should show less & less rather quickly unless you didn't purge out the supply line to the pump very well. Personally, I like to see some air pockets on a fresh engine. Without them you would have no way of verifying the speed of the oil flow or if its moving at all.

 

[ricardo1]

Its very normal to get air in the lines when you first bleed out the system. There are places in the pump & possibly in the filter that pockets of air can get trapped. As long as all the pockets of air & oil are moving away from the pump & into the engine when running, its probably fine. they should however speed way up when you manually turn the oil pump open at running idle, if so, you should be fine. Just double check after that the cable is still connected & the pump is still opening with the throttle afterwards.

That being said, these air pockets should show less & less rather quickly unless you didn't purge out the supply line to the pump very well. Personally, I like to see some air pockets on a fresh engine. Without them you would have no way of verifying the speed of the oil flow or if its moving at all.

The thing is the engine has been on for around 10 seconds before and even with me holding the pump open with no avail, how can I lubricate the bottom end I'm worried about it.

 

[68ragtop]

10 seconds isn't enough time, you need to run it longer. while I think its great that you are being cautious, I think your worrying a little bit too much. like we mentioned earlier, when these engines are rebuilt professionally, there is a LOT of oil put in them before you get your hands on it. In fact, I am willing to bet you have at least a 3/8" deep puddle of injection oil in the the bottom of your case sides right now. To ease your mind call SES at (267) 432-3169. they can confirm this for you. When BRP sends out a rebuilt crank, they literally submerge the entire thing in a bath of oil, let it drip dry, put it in a bag & ship it out. (not the whole engine, just the crank ) I am willing to bet SES does the same thing. Oil is a new engines lifeline, so while we need to make sure your pump is operating, you can be assured there is already more than enough oil in the engine.

When I first fired my 951DI, I had the carbon seal clip removed, fired it up, turned on the cooling water, checked the pump for oil movement, then inspected for water leaks, shut off the water, & stopped the engine. I'll bet I ran mine for 1-2 minutes the first time it came to life.

On the other hand, if the engine was assembled by someone without experience & that person didn't use any oil in the process, I wouldn't even want to touch the start button.....

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

You can add oil through the throttle bodies, one ounce each to start with till you see smoke, smoke tells you there's plenty-o-oil oil. Too much oil and hydrolock occurs, so go slowly adding oil, one ounce per side should last a good while(it will be in crankcase around crankshaft) at low speeds on trailer testing your ski.

Then hold that oil pump open, I think if you get the level set to max position it will smoke like an indian signal fire but it takes a while to balance oil level in the crankcase. So add oil slowly one ounce per side in increments till you verify it's smoking good, there will already be some there and it may not take much before the smoke starts rolling out. You want to see smoke, it tells you there's enough oil in the cases.

Too much oil can't hurt anything (unless there's a ton and it hydrolocks), too little oil is to be avoided.

Why people won't add oil I can never understand, I give mine a healthy drink after every ride.

 

[ricardo1]

So I got water and soap on the carbon ring while I was holding the oil pump wide open and after a minute the lines looked like this, I could smell the oil but not really see it much. Now i have an exhaust leak and find why the maint light is on.

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[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Yep, fix the exhaust leak, that's a no-bueno for sure. I agree you may as well remove the carbon ring clip till you're ready to go splash it, and you should be able to get some noticeable amount of smoke by using the oil pump lever I'd expect, the crankcase may still be filling but once it does have plenty the smoke will arrive and you'll know it's there. Once you reach this point you should be able to turn on and off the smoke by rotating the oil pump lever, there will be a short delay of maybe 30 seconds, my guess.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Also try resetting the maint feature, it's possible there's no real problem just it's timed out for the service reminder and telling you to service the ski?

I think you can press and hold "SET" button on info center to reset the "MAINT" counter but I'm not completely familiar with operating your fancy gauge package, so you have to see if it's possible to reset the timer yourself, maybe that's the only real reason.

 

[ricardo1]

I inserted the key and hold the set button for around 5 second and it gave me the option to change to English and then the maint light will come back on with the red light as well, going to get new 93 oct gas before going home and going to try and fix the exhaust leak and hopefully find the plug that maybe I didn't connect.
Big thanks to sportster and 68ragtop for all the help.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Maybe try using "MODE" button to scroll and reach the feature you want to reset then using the "SET" button press and hold "SET" button for reset?

 

[ricardo1]

I will try that when I get home today, excited about getting this ski running and having fun at the lake.

 

[68ragtop]

On my RX, I just had to hold the set button in for a few seconds right after installing the key.
Mine had the timed maintenance warning on, in addition to all the others at the time.

But, like "jack" mentioned above you almost need to see if it is 4K rev limited. If it is, there are bigger things probably going on. The resettable timer won't restrict anything.

 

[ricardo1]

Turn the ski on the trailer and rev it to 4k, plug the water hose or just quick rev then shut off?

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Quick rev try to reach 4500 to test if MPEM will limit the RPM to 4000 only. This takes less than 30 seconds so there won't be enough heat to require cooling water. Then if it won't rev you will have to begin troubleshooting. I suspect it won't rev. If you do plan to run for longer than 1 minute then I would use cooling water (from the hose).

Before taking the ski to the lake I would release the carbon seal clip and run it for 10 minutes or more using cooling water from the hose. During this test I would rev it to over 4500 RPM several times.

 

[ricardo1]

Good news the ski got to 4790 rpm(didn't want to rev it too much) and loads of smoke came out due to me holding the oil pump 3/4 open!

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Some is good, still wondering about the :MAINT" but if the MPEM is happy enough to rev then all should be okay for water test.

Keep a close eye on those plugs.

 

[ricardo1]

Went ahead and did a comp check on both cylinders for the heck of it and front reads 125 rear reads 90??

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Two possibilities (there may be more but I don't see them) for "MAINT" without RPM limit are "fuel level sensor" and "throttle position sensor single adaption fault".

So maybe your fuel tank is near empty or the fuel sensor is not functioning?

 

[ricardo1]

I got some fresh 93 oct gas today around 4 gallons so maybe it's the fuel seonsor?

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Went ahead and did a comp check on both cylinders for the heck of it and front reads 125 rear reads 90??

Did you compression check before first fire? 90psi is a little low there, maybe you need some more run time to seat the rings. You can remove the RAVE to inspect the piston skirt and rings for unusual signs. Have you run this engine more than 1 minute yet? The compression can be a little low at first until the rings are seated to the cylinders.

 

[ricardo1]

I did not do a compression check before first fire, this engine has maybe a total of close to 2 minutes total.

 

[ricardo1]

after removing the raves the rear one has couple lines all the way at the bottom.

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

Sorry, maybe I made a mistake, the "throttle position sensor (single adaption fault)" doesn't give any warning or RPM limit.

"fuel level sensor" causes no RPM limit + "MAINT + red led + no buzzer

"Diagnostic cap removed fault" causes no RPM limit + "MAINT" + red led + no buzzer

 

[Sportster-2001-951C-Stock]

after removing the raves the rear one has couple lines all the way at the bottom.

I think you could not have caused any damage in just 2 minutes, probably the rings aren't seated. I bet the lines you see at the bottom of piston sleeve are very faint and meaningless? Call your engine rebuilder and tell him about your observation (90psi on rear) and get his permission to continue.