Few questions about Sportsters/speedsters/challengers

[ksgries]

So im looking for some pricing info and just some info to clear up what im looking for.

First off since everything on craigslist is mislabeled which years of the older speedster/sportster/challenger had the 2 captains chairs and the seats in the back? and is it on the 1800 ones that have those seats? My friends and I aren't small guys, there are 5 of us and i know the pains of jumping wakes on the bow seat so the smaller size wont do.

Second which of those models/years had dual engines, more hp. I Would be interested in the mercury engine models buttt 2 engines are more reliable then one (in a failure situation)and from what ive seen the merc engine is more expensive to replace and harder to find.

Okay now on to pricing, on the northeast people seem to want a lot for boats with upholstery that needs replacing and blown engine boats. How much should i really be looking to be paying for an engine with a bad interior and blown engines, vs an a boat that just needs some serious detailing. On cl i see prices from 1000 for really shitty and no title all the way to 8 grand for a 2000..

I know its hard to judge a price without seeing a boat but im just looking for a baseline

 

[ialonso]

So im looking for some pricing info and just some info to clear up what im looking for.

First off since everything on craigslist is mislabeled which years of the older speedster/sportster/challenger had the 2 captains chairs and the seats in the back? and is it on the 1800 ones that have those seats? My friends and I aren't small guys, there are 5 of us and i know the pains of jumping wakes on the bow seat so the smaller size wont do.

Second which of those models/years had dual engines, more hp. I Would be interested in the mercury engine models buttt 2 engines are more reliable then one (in a failure situation)and from what ive seen the merc engine is more expensive to replace and harder to find.

Okay now on to pricing, on the northeast people seem to want a lot for boats with upholstery that needs replacing and blown engine boats. How much should i really be looking to be paying for an engine with a bad interior and blown engines, vs an a boat that just needs some serious detailing. On cl i see prices from 1000 for really shitty and no title all the way to 8 grand for a 2000..

I know its hard to judge a price without seeing a boat but im just looking for a baseline

http://www.seadoowarehouse.com/parts.php?type=boat

I believe all 1800 prior to 99 and after 96 are twin engine.

From there you can browse parts and end up here (For example for 1999 Sportster 1800 http://partsfinder.onlinemicrofiche...?Type=13&make=seadoojb&a=167&b=26&c=0&d=-SEAT
)

You can see all the 1999 parts list on the link above. You can browse part pictures to determine the seat configuration for each boat. feel free to jump around year by year to examine all the configurations. Engine info can also be found there.
Good Luck!

 

[Isaac-1]

Ok, limiting the choices to the boats with the captains chairs and twin engines, I think you are going to be looking at the 97-99 Challenger 1800 which is a 7 passenger boat with about 1250 pound cargo capacity with twin 787's, (I have a 99 Sportster 1800 which is the 7 passenger with the 3 across bench seating at the back and twin 717's), you will also have the 98?-99 Speedster 5 passenger (really 4 not counting the bow seat) about 750 pound cargo capacity with twin 787's.

As to pricing it does vary by region, I bought my boat about 6 weeks ago, paid $2,200, but it needed work (more than I realized when I bought it, but that is the way boats are) including replaceing one engine, rebuilding carburetors, carbon seals, wear rings, etc. and has upholstery that is functional, but needs replacement (I am at $4,500 out of pocket and still need to budget for upholstery, hydro turf, and a new bimini top before I would be happy). In my area (200 mile radius) running condition 98-99 5 passenger speedsters start out with advertised prices around $3,600, but tend to need some TLC, and about $5,000 fully lake ready, and around $6,500 for garage kept, low hour, etc. Challenger 1800 that I have seen advertised start around $5,500 needing TLC, and mostly run $6,500+ lake ready, there is one near here with a $9,000 asking price, but it is garage kept, new stereo, etc. Part of the reason I choose the Sportster 1800 was that they tend to sell about $2,000 less than comparable Challenger 1800.

 

[ksgries]

Thanks for the help guys! Really cleared a few things up. Are parts for the boats readily availible and not super expensive? There's a challenger 1800 by me with 1 good engine and one that won't start, but the guy started to part it out, all electronics are gone, shifter, 2 carbs and a few Seats.
But it is only 1000 with a title and trailer

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[MLars]

Parts are readily available and extremely cheap because most are also used on the jetskis. If the electronics are gone, I wouldn't even bother with it. Maybe you could pick it up and continue parting it out to find your project?

 

[ksgries]

ill skip over it then

 

[Isaac-1]

Some parts are cheap, some are expensive, and some are nearly unobtainable, I would not go with a boat that has been started to be parted out as the nearly unobtainable ones are the ones that are likely to be sold first.

Here are a few examples of some of the pricier parts:

Boat MPEM $1,500+ used, it seems each boat, and almost each year had a unique MPEM, there are some generic retrofits showing up on the market, but they are not yet out for all boat models.

Gear shift lever assembly in working condition is around $500 used

Seats are another nearly unobtainable, if you are lucky enough to find them as a set you may pay as little as $1,500, carburetors are relatively cheap at about $300 each, plus rebuild cost, and a replacement 787 engine will run you about $1,500 if you have a core to turn in.


So just on the stuff you mention you are looking at around $5,000 before surprises

 

[ksgries]

that's a definite pass then lol

 

[ksgries]

saw this http://newlondon.craigslist.org/boa/5134949874.html i figure i could get him to 1-1200 it would definitely be a winter resto if anything. Im not sure if the exterior could be buffed back to life? Would definitely need new upholstery some foam repair 600+/- right there. Says engines need a rebuild..who knows what they really need though I could do them myself most likely, ive rebuilt a few 2 stroke quads so depending on bottom or top 600ish for top kits, rebuild/clean the carbs(i can probably do that myself too) and 200-300 on spray paint and misc parts seems about right.

worth it? obviously some serious time would need to be put into it. My main concern would be the faded exterior/stickers, they piss me off hahaha can those stickers come off or are they painted on? I just wouldn't want to have to get it gel coated or painted since with my lack of boat experience i don't think i could do it myself.

 

[ialonso]

saw this http://newlondon.craigslist.org/boa/5134949874.html i figure i could get him to 1-1200 it would definitely be a winter resto if anything. Im not sure if the exterior could be buffed back to life? Would definitely need new upholstery some foam repair 600+/- right there. Says engines need a rebuild..who knows what they really need though I could do them myself most likely, ive rebuilt a few 2 stroke quads so depending on bottom or top 600ish for top kits, rebuild/clean the carbs(i can probably do that myself too) and 200-300 on spray paint and misc parts seems about right.

worth it? obviously some serious time would need to be put into it. My main concern would be the faded exterior/stickers, they piss me off hahaha can those stickers come off or are they painted on? I just wouldn't want to have to get it gel coated or painted since with my lack of boat experience i don't think i could do it myself.

That interior is pretty messed up. and it's been sitting in the sun for a long time...even if you got it free, you are looking at some serious cash before you can enjoy a good looking boat.I would pass unless I had a cheap source of foam and sew way better than I do. Engines/electrical and pump are totally unknown, and can't be tested with the engines pulled.

 

[ksgries]

That interior is pretty messed up. and it's been sitting in the sun for a long time...even if you got it free, you are looking at some serious cash before you can enjoy a good looking boat.I would pass unless I had a cheap source of foam and sew way better than I do. Engines/electrical and pump are totally unknown, and can't be tested with the engines pulled.

its tough finding a reasonably priced resto around here with either the interior being destroyed, or the engines being in an unknown condition. People seem to want close to 3 here for a 5-7 seater in resto condition. Just gotta keep looking i guess

 

[Isaac-1]

My big concern about that one is it seems to be a Florida boat, which means it was ALWAYS within about 50 miles of salt water, so the chances of it being a fresh water only boat are slim. Even with the issues I have ran into with my boat, I am VERY glad it seems to have been fresh water only, and I have NO corrosion issues. As to what to buy on these boats, it depends on if you are looking for a project, or looking for a working boat. There are a LOT of project boats out there, and most do not make economic sense to fix, but each persons situation is different, for me I was working with a $3,800 or so cash in hand budget and spent that all (and then some) within about a 10 day period, $2,200 for the boat with 1 bad engine, about another $400 on the trailer (2 new wheels and tires due to slight dry rot, new LED lights, and fenders, plus a wheel hub assembly) , then another $1,600 to buy and have a good pull out engine installed in the boat (there were about $400 in unexpecteds expenses here, including a new starter relay and new CDI

So lets say about $4,200 on the major stuff including $400 of trailer expenses that could have probably waited till winter, but I did not want to risk it.

In addition to this over the last month I have bought various parts for DIY projects

$65 wear rings

$125 for new intake grates (both sides were missing)

$125 for a nice used impeller (one of them was dinged, maybe marginal hard call could have probbaly skipped this)

$150 for 2 carbon seal kits with boots (one is leaking water into the boat, might as well change both while I have stuff pulled apart)

$25 on new latches for ski compartment and storage compartment

$20 on new drive shaft bumpers

$20 on new registration lettering (old was ugly and peeling)

$100 on carburetor rebuild kit, gaskets, etc.

$225 for an AGM deep cycle battery

Add to this probably another $250+ for polising / cutting compound, wax, polshing pads, lanyard, vinyl SEA DOO lettering, depth sounder GPS, new cup holder inserts, pump oil, buzzer, new horn, LED bow and stern light, etc. and a whole lot of my free labor.

Let not forget the $300+ on boat insurance from Progressive

And still another $1,000 - $1,500 left to go before I am done ($375 for Hydro-Turf mats, $600 or so on new upolstery, and say another $350 on a new bimini top (upholstery and bimini can wait, hydro-turf will probably happen next month once I get all the DIY stuff mentioned above done .

Once you add all that stuff up those $7,000 -$9,000 boats start looking attractive

 

[ksgries]

Well I'm not reallllly worried about a saltwater boat. I'll primarily be using it in saltwater since I live 5 minutes from the bay over here. So I figure if I just take care of it after each run I should be fine for a few years till I get a new boat.

But yeah I totally understand what your saying about just spending money on a working sea worthy boat rather then dropping the same money into a resto/modding it. I know no matter what I end up with after its in running condition ill be modding It up making it custom lol just how I am. Heck if I didn't have a new truck that I modded up and have a ton of debt over I would probably just be financing a new scarab or Glastron Hahah

Anyway if I could find a boat that had atleast 1 engine running was complete and needed a complete interior restore I would be happy with that, but they don't seem to exist over on the northeast right now. Atleast within 200 miles of central Jersey

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[Isaac-1]

This may be a scam http://www.ebay.com/itm/1997-seadoo...oat-/201400377884?hash=item2ee465e21c&vxp=mtr personally I never fool with anything that does not have a clear title, and methods of legally getting one varies from state to state.

Ike

p.s. from the small world department, I see it is in Mapleshade NJ, as chance would have it I spent a week in a motel about a mile away from there in Mt. Laurel, NJ in May of this year, and drove through Mapleshade each day going to an industry certification class.

 

[ksgries]

Yeah there's one south of me like that too, 600 for it but no title from past owner on boat or trailer. I've heard mixed things about getting a title for boats like that in nj.

I'll get in touch with that guy, see what he says about why he doesn't have a title.

I'm actually up by mt laurel a lot during the winter

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[ksgries]

so the guy tells me it doesn't have a title because the dealership he bough it from never got one "they had to get a hold of the person who traded it in years ago, ive been waiting 3 months for it. Im either go to sell it here or go get my money back"

lol ill pass

 

[jhjesse]

saw this http://newlondon.craigslist.org/boa/5134949874.html i figure i could get him to 1-1200 it would definitely be a winter resto if anything. Im not sure if the exterior could be buffed back to life? Would definitely need new upholstery some foam repair 600+/- right there. Says engines need a rebuild..who knows what they really need though I could do them myself most likely, ive rebuilt a few 2 stroke quads so depending on bottom or top 600ish for top kits, rebuild/clean the carbs(i can probably do that myself too) and 200-300 on spray paint and misc parts seems about right.

worth it? obviously some serious time would need to be put into it. My main concern would be the faded exterior/stickers, they piss me off hahaha can those stickers come off or are they painted on? I just wouldn't want to have to get it gel coated or painted since with my lack of boat experience i don't think i could do it myself.

These boats are gel coat and it is pretty thick. You can use Maguire's heavy cut followed by fine cut, polish and wax. Guarantee it will look like new with some elbow grease. Worst case you would have to wet sand first before rubbing compound.

 

[Isaac-1]

For an idea what some compounding and a dual action polisher can do see the big version of my avatar photo

 

[ksgries]

Oh wow that makes quite a difference

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[hotrodssnova]

I used 2000 grit wet sand then went with the compounds. My boat sat for about 4 years outside in Houston.

 

[Isaac-1]

As you can tell the above photo was far from the finished job, and was on the first pass but what you see was done with just Mequiers Ultimate compound http://www.meguiars.com/en/automotive/products/g17216-ultimate-compound/ I could have probably used something more aggressive, but using just this on the turquoise cover I was able to make it blend so the area protected by the old vinyl letters was nearly indistinguishable from the rest of the fiberglass. On other parts of the boat I used Meguiers One Step marine compound (not sold locally so I ordered from Amazon), it may be a little more agressive than the Ultimate compound, but I think I like the way the Ultimate compound feels better.