O k I took my 97 xp out the other day and it started losing power like it was not getting fuel so I replaced all of my gray fuel lines and cleaned out my carb filters. I then took I back out on the river and it ran good except it seemed to be running at a lower RPM than normal but all and all it was running good .It ran like that for about 15 min then I hit a wave a little hard and it just died. I figured that the lanyard just got knocked loose from the hard hit but when I tried to restart it it did not want to turn over. I waited a min then tried again and it started but when I tried to give it some gas it sputtered and died. I then checked the engine to see if it was hot and the PTO side cylinder was too hot to touch. I am not sure how hot it is suppose to be but it felt pretty hot. If the engine did overheat what symptoms could I expect? I am not sure how it would have overheated because i could see the water squirting out so there was water flowing through the system. What could cause the engine to overheat?
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engine trouble
- Thread starter wholf09
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Grey lines...
The root cause is probably going to be your grey fuel lines. Did your temp sensor go off?
When you replaced the grey lines, did you remove the low speed screws and blow out all the trash from those crappy fuel lines.
So many members will come in and say, "hey, I replaced them but they seem o.k..." The problem is deterioration. The vent line is about the only line not affected by this stuff. What happens is over time, the fuel causes the inside liner of the Tempo lines to dissolve. When soluable, the goo travels through your fuel circuit. When it finds a place where the fuel isn't moving so briskly, it settles down and re-hardens. This happens in your diaphragm area and needle valves (low speed screws).
What it sounds like with you feeling the heat is, your mag carb may be running good but the goo has gummed up your low speed screw internal porting.
You need to, at the very least, remove this screw and spray some carb cleaner into it. I'd personally remove the carb and go through it again.
The micro mesh filters will look clean but I've tried to blow through one before, to find it was blocked up bad.
Read your plugs. See if your PTO spark plug looks like it's run hot/lean. There are a couple ways to read them. When your problem is present, you need to pull the lanyard off and read them right then. By backing off the fuel, your changing the actual condition of your plug and reading it would give you no input.....
The root cause is probably going to be your grey fuel lines. Did your temp sensor go off?
When you replaced the grey lines, did you remove the low speed screws and blow out all the trash from those crappy fuel lines.
So many members will come in and say, "hey, I replaced them but they seem o.k..." The problem is deterioration. The vent line is about the only line not affected by this stuff. What happens is over time, the fuel causes the inside liner of the Tempo lines to dissolve. When soluable, the goo travels through your fuel circuit. When it finds a place where the fuel isn't moving so briskly, it settles down and re-hardens. This happens in your diaphragm area and needle valves (low speed screws).
What it sounds like with you feeling the heat is, your mag carb may be running good but the goo has gummed up your low speed screw internal porting.
You need to, at the very least, remove this screw and spray some carb cleaner into it. I'd personally remove the carb and go through it again.
The micro mesh filters will look clean but I've tried to blow through one before, to find it was blocked up bad.
Read your plugs. See if your PTO spark plug looks like it's run hot/lean. There are a couple ways to read them. When your problem is present, you need to pull the lanyard off and read them right then. By backing off the fuel, your changing the actual condition of your plug and reading it would give you no input.....
thanks
Thanks for the quick reply. I was thinking what if the PTO accelerator pump was spraying but the mag spout was plugged could this cause the problem as well? Also do you have a link to a forum that shows how to check the plugs for lean running? Do I have to put it back in the river or can I test for lean pluges on the trailer?
Thanks for the quick reply. I was thinking what if the PTO accelerator pump was spraying but the mag spout was plugged could this cause the problem as well? Also do you have a link to a forum that shows how to check the plugs for lean running? Do I have to put it back in the river or can I test for lean pluges on the trailer?
Spark plugs...
If you look in the bottom of this post, you'll see a hyper link to "snipes korner". There I have a chart on spark plugs from running lean to running rich and oil fouled. The pix are set up with numbers so you can look at the right paragraph for the condition of the plug.
Now, your accelerator pump will not cause hot running conditions. This is going to be a jet related issue, probably your low speed jet.
The accelerator pump is only used for the first couple seconds off idle, then it is rendered useless till you bring the throttle back to idle......
Its harder to get a true reading out of the water, since there is no torque on the motor.
If you take it out, run it upwards of 3k rpm, you'll get a reading of both the high speed and low speed screw. But, the only way to do it is to pull the lanyard off while your at that specific rpm.
This is a brief explanation of your carbs jetting. At idle, your fuel is being introduced through your low speed jets. When you go to accelerate, the accelerator pump gives a shot of fuel to help the motor build manifold pressure. As you start into going up on plane, the low speed and high speed come into transition, accelerator pump does nothing. About mid throttle, your on both parts of the fuel circuit inside the carb. When you hit wide open throttle, the main jet is providing all your fuel, the low speed is now shut down.....
If you look in the bottom of this post, you'll see a hyper link to "snipes korner". There I have a chart on spark plugs from running lean to running rich and oil fouled. The pix are set up with numbers so you can look at the right paragraph for the condition of the plug.
Now, your accelerator pump will not cause hot running conditions. This is going to be a jet related issue, probably your low speed jet.
The accelerator pump is only used for the first couple seconds off idle, then it is rendered useless till you bring the throttle back to idle......
Its harder to get a true reading out of the water, since there is no torque on the motor.
If you take it out, run it upwards of 3k rpm, you'll get a reading of both the high speed and low speed screw. But, the only way to do it is to pull the lanyard off while your at that specific rpm.
This is a brief explanation of your carbs jetting. At idle, your fuel is being introduced through your low speed jets. When you go to accelerate, the accelerator pump gives a shot of fuel to help the motor build manifold pressure. As you start into going up on plane, the low speed and high speed come into transition, accelerator pump does nothing. About mid throttle, your on both parts of the fuel circuit inside the carb. When you hit wide open throttle, the main jet is providing all your fuel, the low speed is now shut down.....
pop off test
When doing the pop off test are the springs suppose to pop or bleed off? Mine just bleed off around 42 psi . What can I doo to make then pop?
Also i have both of them bleeding off at 42psi with the cover and diaphragm off. If i place the diaphragm and screw the cover back on then they will start to bleed off around the high 30's and then release at 42 and then stop releasing in the upper 20's and hold there. Will this be fine or do they need to be adjusted?
Thanks for all the help.
When doing the pop off test are the springs suppose to pop or bleed off? Mine just bleed off around 42 psi . What can I doo to make then pop?
Also i have both of them bleeding off at 42psi with the cover and diaphragm off. If i place the diaphragm and screw the cover back on then they will start to bleed off around the high 30's and then release at 42 and then stop releasing in the upper 20's and hold there. Will this be fine or do they need to be adjusted?
Thanks for all the help.
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Pop test
Yes I did wet the needle with WD-40. My main concern is that when i place the cover and diaphgram back on the needle valve starts releasing in the upper 30's (psi) and not at the 42 psi like it does when the cover and diaphgram are off. Is this normal ? O and i did make sure that the needle valve lever arm was where it was suppose to be . Thanks for the help.
Yes I did wet the needle with WD-40. My main concern is that when i place the cover and diaphgram back on the needle valve starts releasing in the upper 30's (psi) and not at the 42 psi like it does when the cover and diaphgram are off. Is this normal ? O and i did make sure that the needle valve lever arm was where it was suppose to be . Thanks for the help.
It MUST pass the leak down test after re-assembly. grease the screw threads so
next time (hopefully a long time) will be easy to remove. No point in putting on the engine at this time. Open up and see why it has lever interference. You may need to bend it so the diapham does not push on it when cover is put on.
next time (hopefully a long time) will be easy to remove. No point in putting on the engine at this time. Open up and see why it has lever interference. You may need to bend it so the diapham does not push on it when cover is put on.
leak down
What do you mean by leak down test? Do you mean the test to see if it holds 10 psi for 10 seconds it will hold 20 psi for allot more than 10 seconds. As for bending the lever right now the lever is level with the area sounding it just as like procedure calls for it to be. Should I bend it lower? I guess the real question is will it hurt to bend it lower and should the pop off pressure change when I place the diaphragm and cover back on?
What do you mean by leak down test? Do you mean the test to see if it holds 10 psi for 10 seconds it will hold 20 psi for allot more than 10 seconds. As for bending the lever right now the lever is level with the area sounding it just as like procedure calls for it to be. Should I bend it lower? I guess the real question is will it hurt to bend it lower and should the pop off pressure change when I place the diaphragm and cover back on?
Applying # 2 PERMATEX FORM AN GASKET SEALANT
When reinstalling a carb and using 2 PERMATEX FORM AN GASKET SEALANT do you put the sealant on both top and bottom of the gasket? I know its a stupid question but i am just trying to cross all my t's and so on.
When reinstalling a carb and using 2 PERMATEX FORM AN GASKET SEALANT do you put the sealant on both top and bottom of the gasket? I know its a stupid question but i am just trying to cross all my t's and so on.
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crap
Ok i have reinstalled the carbs and still no luck. The engine will not idle it just runes rough and then dies . What is the best way set the idle? Also thereis still air in the lines here is a link to a video of what it is doing. one showes the air in the lines.one showes how rough it is running.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjj1sMOZbGI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AoOxYD5vM4U
Ok i have reinstalled the carbs and still no luck. The engine will not idle it just runes rough and then dies . What is the best way set the idle? Also thereis still air in the lines here is a link to a video of what it is doing. one showes the air in the lines.one showes how rough it is running.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjj1sMOZbGI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AoOxYD5vM4U
air?
any entry point must be sealed somehow to prevent the lean-out that spoils the sliding parts inside the motor, I did not read where you did compression test? or I missed it, when the idling is rough pull the choke to see if it comes back from the leanout, snipe mentioned a great idea - place a grocery bag over the flame screen if you do not have 3 arms to pull the choke cable when the idle goes sloppy.
When there is air in the lines you have a leaky fuel line, fuel/water bowl or fuel switch, take a minute and make sure all the line connectors are not allowing air to enter the fuel system,
any entry point must be sealed somehow to prevent the lean-out that spoils the sliding parts inside the motor, I did not read where you did compression test? or I missed it, when the idling is rough pull the choke to see if it comes back from the leanout, snipe mentioned a great idea - place a grocery bag over the flame screen if you do not have 3 arms to pull the choke cable when the idle goes sloppy.
Ok I installed new fuel pump check valves on today and when I apply a vacuum to the inlet line I still get some air flow in from the outlet line. Correct me if I am wrong but you are not supposed to get air flow when you apply a vacuum to the inlet line are you? Also when I apply pressure to the out let I also get air flow from the inlet. Is this supposed to happen or is something wrong? I am sure the check valves are fine, after all they are new. I can apply 4 psi to the pulse line and it holds so no leaks there. When doing the pop off test if I pressure the carb up and it will bleed off slowly about 1psi every 5 seconds it bleeds out of the return line not the needle valve. I guess that this is fine but I am not sure. I mean I know that there is going to be a little bleed back to the tank or why would there be a return line.
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