Boat cannot run fast

[robin savell lloyd]

mpem will not alow starter to turn over in the full rpm mode. it first has to have a revlimiter mode signal from switch, and then after engine started and is in gear the switch tells mpem that it is no longer in nutrual then mpem will alow full rpm's. but I can be wrong.

 

[Ador Raga]

Ok. Ok... thanks a lot.
Next ...
I have opened the assembly and looked at the switch and founbd out that it is returning, or should I say, go down and uo when I released it. I am not sure if this gets released/pressed in neutral or in gear/reverse though. I sprayed WD40 to anything I thought would benefit and put them back. I don't know if it may have fixed the problem.
Meanwhile, I placed the water hose and started the engine in neutral. I have the throttle in full and feel the boat vibrates hard but RPM is about 3000. Is it normal to get at most 3000RPM in neutral? Also while the engine was running on water hose, the engine sounds like is was drowning and then it stops. I could restart the engine easily but again stops after a few seconds. Something familiar?
I saw some debris on the impeller and once I took them off, I noticed that there were 2 pieces of white substance hanging. I cannot remove them as if they were there plastered like gum. Are they part of the assembly or they should be removed?

 

[robin savell lloyd]

Ador Raga sory about the debate on the bypass isue. this forum is a very good place for us new and old water craft mechanics to get a good understanding of how these things work without haveing to have worked on all of them. and if we ever run into a problem we may have a beter know how of what is wrong. it also alows us to give beter info to guest and members in the future. not all threads get jacked like this one. now back to your question. yes engine will idle at 3000 out of water it will idle lower when it is put in water. can you post photo of what you may think is causing vibration. I have my shifter out of my boat at the moment it is the only thing I have to replace after replacing my uphoulstry if you need me to to test mine so you know what open and close is I can. but I would think it would not be needed as you can test your own. but if you need any help we are here. robin

 

[seadoosnipe]

How true.....

How true Robin....the debates are sometimes how we are able to come up with answers.....now I also see one of your points Robin. Yes, the circuit has to be open for start, but after starting, if you manually open that circuit, then you should be able to get unlimite rpm.
Posting pictures of what your talking about is the best way for us to understand what your seeing. I can tell you though, you shouldn't see anything out of the ordinary from your intake grates through the impeller, the stator, or through the nozzle.
The issue with the motor running the way it does, may be attributed to a water leak. Have you read your plugs?
Try this. Start the motor. Let it run without water. You have a minute or so before it gets hot. See how the motor runs with no water connected to it. You will be o.k....if by some chance, you run it to long, the continuous beeper will sound to let you know your hot......shut it down right away.
Now, with that done, did the engine run good? Or did it run crappy the same why. If it ran good, that means water is getting into your engine.
Post a pix, let us know how the engine runs without water. Just be aware, you can run for short periods of time with no water.....just not for extended periods of time. But this will be long enough to let you listen to the engine and find out if this may be a problem.
Good luck, let us know what you find out.
Oh, and like Robin said, under normal conditions, the engines idle is limited to 3000 rpm. In the water, the torque on the shaft, will lower it to about 1000.

 

[Ador Raga]

Fnally, I found out that there were debris between the nozzle and impeller. That thing I thought was white rubber LOOKING LIKE GUM is about 3 inches by 1/2 inch hard wood, and I cannot figure out how it got in there.

It took me more than an hour to take it out since it is about 9 inches from the edge of the nozzle. I have to hammer my billiard cue to break the wood into pieces. Yes me cues is now damaged but the wood in the impeller has been removed.

I have confidently ran the engine for more than a minute as you have adivsed and it seems to me that it is OK, and still idling at 3000RPM, though I can hear the coarse sound coming from the impeller.

Is there way to test if it could now run more than 10mph and rev more than 3000 without going to the water? I am excited to go but my kids have the championship games today.

I know that the debirs have caused the very poor performance of the boat. Is it also the reason why RPM is only up to 3000?

Thanks.

 

[seadoosnipe]

Yes.....

Yes, you can. Get your garden hose hooked up. Start the motor. Once the engine is warmed up a minute or two, push your gear shift leaver into forward gear. That will de-activate the neutral switch from the mpem.
Then, "goose" the throttle. What I mean by "goose" is to push the throttle up and back really fast. If the engine is running well, you'll probably hit at least 5k before your hands' response can get the throttle back to idle. Reason being, is these motors will free wheel really easy without any torque on the impeller.
I do it though, just goosing it a little. Never hold the throttle down on it. Just hit it back and forth a couple times.
The wood in your between your impellor and stator has probably damaged your wearing ring. I see your boat is identical to mine. It's a very simple pump to remove if you need to. You may be able to get under it, drop the grate from the cockpit and inspect it that way.
Good luck, let us know what you find out!......

 

[Ador Raga]

Was out in the water this afternoon and the results are not very encouraging.
First, the engine starts well but at idle it drags the boat forward as if it is on gear. I am sure it is not on gear because I cannot start the engine and the systems beeps a warning. Once it starts, the engine will slowly turn off as it did when I placed the water hose.
There was a time that I was able to try to put it in forward gear and then the boat moves forward but the throttle will make the engine louder but no power. This was the same condition as was before when I opened this thread.
My added problem now is that that the engine seems drowning with water and that it is moving the water even in neutral.
Do you have any further suggestions. In the meantime, any tip about the wear ring and how will I order (specs like part no) it and how much? I am ready to take the challenge of disassembling the impeller and putting it back. :cheers:

 

[seadoosnipe]

wearing ring...

So now, with the fact that you get a raise in rpm, but no movement, then it sounds you have done significant damage to your wearing ring. The pump will have to be removed, inspected and more than likely, replaced. This is quite an easy task on your boat. I've done it several times.
The boat moving forward when in idle is an easy adjustment to your reverse gate on the back of the pump housing. There is an adjustment nut and locking nut. But, if there is wearing ring damage, this may also contribute to your drifting in the reverse direction while at idle.
As for the engine drowning out, this could be a problem. You said, running on the hose, when the boat was at home, did the same thing. Have you tried running the boat without any water? You can do this for a minute or so to test it. If it sounds good, then you have a leak in a gasket on your water jacket.
Test the compression, run it without the water hose and get back to us.
NOTE:.....I just re-read your post....I see you have ran it without the water and it seemed to run well. Try it again, as soon as you start it, put it in forward gear, goose the throttle (quickly run throttle up and down, really fast) to check the sound of the engine and throttle response. Then, shut it down ASAP....especially if you hear the over heat buzzer going off.....then re-post........

 

[Ador Raga]

Even without the water hose, engine will start for a moment and then stops. I cannot try to put it on gear and goose the throttle because the engine always stops.

I have observed the nozzle section and I found the following:
- The Ski/Speed lever moves the nozzle up/down
- The steering moves the nozzle left/right
- The throttle is not moving anything.
- The gear lever is not moving anything.

Putting the gear forward or reverse does not affect anything at the nozzle assembly. I have the gut feel that something could be wrong here, because the last time I observed this, the gear lever moves up/down the thing that is above the nozzle.

What do you think? Any suggestions? Thanks a lot.

 

[seadoosnipe]

Linkages....

Yes, the controller on your left, nearest the steering wheel, should control the reverse bucket. The plastic that that moves the plastic cup thing over the nozzle. Look at that linkage on the back, make sure it's connected. For that matter, look at all the lingages in the back.
The throttle is in the middle. You wont' see that from there, that connects to the engine's carbs on the inside. You'll have to have the motor in forward gear, look at the throttle linkage with a mirror facing up, because that linkage faces down, toward the bottom of the boat, then your far right, controls the VTS on the nozzle. Makes the nozzle trim up and down. If your steering linkage o.k.? If the linkage on the nozzle end is o.k., then your going to have to pull your control handle assembly............

 

[Ador Raga]

The gear cable is damaged. The protective tube that connects the cable to the handle is cut. The cable is still intact, though the housing/tube is already cut and there is at least 2 inches gap that separates the tube when it is on neutral or reverse. The tube will close when in forward. I tried to band the tube together with duck tape while in reverse, but it easily breaks when I put it back to neutral or reverse

Do you have experience or any diagram to show how to fix/replace this cable assembly? Thanks.

 

[seadoosnipe]

Temp....fix

You may want to try a temp fix, to see how it works. The cable is going to be costly. I'll look it up shortly. There are bonding agents on the market that I use. You can find them at the loca "Autozone" or any other parts house. There are epoxys made to bond aluminum, metal and plastic. Get the metal bond. It's inside a see thru tube and you slide it out and cut off a piece, remove the plastic and knead it to mix the two ingedients. Then, with the shifter in a gear that puts that metal tube together, roughen the tube with a coarse sand paper or burring tool for a Dremel or drill motor. Apply the puddy mix. You may have to lay the puddy mix on a piece of wax paper and roll it out flat with a wet glass or something. Then, wrap it around that tube. After rolling it around the tube, use your fingers to knead it into itself so that it becomes a melded piece of putty around that damaged area. Let it dry for at least 24 hours.
This stuff dries as hard as solid steel. I've used it in several places on my engine.....I'm surprsed how good it works.
Oh, I almost forgot. It's out by the J B weld company.

NOTE: From what I see, you may not need to replace the cable. Just the upper end parts to the control assembly. Check this link out and see what you think. http://12.2.215.22/pub/default.asp?...b8e5ac6e95a24&Lang=EN&brands=SPORTBOAT,SEADOO

 

[robin savell lloyd]

I think it just might work if you can cover a large enough surface. I think I will keep a tube of that in my boat from now on. good idea Louis :agree: :cheers:

 

[seadoosnipe]

Sail boat....

I kept a tube of the aluminum and plastic tubes in a work kit of my sail boat. You never know what may happen out there with one of those things. I only had to use the plastic kit once. I got a leak around my thru hull fitting around my transducer to the depth sounder..........
Yeah, I got a tube in the Sea-doo too. They actually have an epoxy blend for a marine application that can be used to repair parts underwater!....

 

[Ador Raga]

Gear Cable

Sorry if it took me a very long time to post.
I have used JB Weld and sure the bond was solid steel but somehow it still cracks when the forward gear is applied. After more than a week of trial and error I think that the bind is really holding well this time. Putting the gear to forward seem tight and hard but it is working since it really moves the cover at the rear assembly. Putting it to reverse is easy but it looks like the cup is in neutral. Is this what it is suppose to respond?

I tried putting the throttle full when i forward gear and sure it hits 5000 RPM, at neutral about 3000RPM max, in reverse easy 5000K. Looks like a good improvement but I am still hesitant to launch it to the lake because I am afraid the bond will break or the reverse may not work.

Do you have any advise for me? Can I find a better bond than JB Weld?

Thanks a lot.

 

[robin savell lloyd]

I like jb weld it seems to work good in alot of applications. I am not sure if this is one of them as it spreads a litle thin. I like Louis's idea about useing epoxy type puddy as it can be easly made to go on thick. I believe it might take a good thick coat 1/8 to 1/4 inch chick and about 4 inches long on cable. 2 inches on each side of break. and needs to be clean dry and roughened up realy good so it will stick. :cheers: