I just bought two ski's; a 97 XP and a 03 XPDI. Both of the batteries were dead in the skis when I went to purchase them. The owner told me they were dead so I pulled a battery out of my quad to bring with me. I used my quad battery and both skis started right up. I let them run for about 10-15 seconds and shut them off. I did compression tests on them which both looked good. I put the plugs back in and started them up on more time and shut them off, hooked up the trailer and headed home. I picked up two new batteries at the local seadoo store on the way home. The xpdi starts right up everytime but the 97 xp wont turn over. I can hear the starter engage and turn the engine about a 1/4 of a turn but thats as far as it goes. I pulled the plugs and the engine turns over fine but when I put the plugs back in and try to start it, the engine again only turns about a 1/4 of a turn and wont go any further. I swapped the batteries between the two quads thinking maybe I got a bad battery, but the same thing happens. Any advise?
-
This site contains eBay affiliate links for which Sea-Doo Forum may be compensated.
97 XP wont turn over
- Thread starter Les67
- Start date
- Status
I know this seems strange but could you have switched plugs? Maybe you now have 1 or 2 longer plugs in and the pistons keeps hitting it.
Otherwise maybe the starter is going and doesn't have enough oomph to kick the motor over while under compression.
what compression readings did you get off both skis?
Also, make sure the 97 doesn't have the gray tempo fuel lines, if so, change them to black auto fuel lines
Otherwise maybe the starter is going and doesn't have enough oomph to kick the motor over while under compression.
what compression readings did you get off both skis?
Also, make sure the 97 doesn't have the gray tempo fuel lines, if so, change them to black auto fuel lines
Thanks for the help guys but I can't see crossing the wires; one of the wires is shorter than the other and it wont quite reach the further cylinder. As for the grey tempo lines, all of the fuel lines are grey in in color. I'm guessing by your statement these have problems? Leaking? If so, I can change them all.
I tried turning the motor over with the sparkplug wires plugged into the factory posts at the starter solenoid so the engine would have no spark at all. Still it would not turn over. I pulled the plugs and the engine turned over fine. I tried with just one plug screwed n the head and it would still not turn over. I took another compression test, both cylinders are at 115psi. When I put it back together. It turned over like it supposed to with the plugs in and wires connected. I was suprised when this happened and let off the starter switch. When I tried it again, it went back to the same thing where it only turns over about 1/4 turn.
Are these starters known for having problems? I was thinking maybe voltage drop in the wiring so I took a pair of jumper cables and went from the battery to the starter post and grounded the negative side to the block. Still the starter turned over 1/4 of a turn then stops.
I may have left one thing out. When I push the igintion switch, and the starter turns the engine 1/4 of a turn; it does this constantly if I dont let go of the switch. I looked at the drive shaft and it turns about 1/4 of a turn, the goes back to its original position and continues this motion if I don't let go of the iginition switch. I was thinking if the starter didn't have enough energy to push the pistion past TDC, then it would just hold it where it would max out on energy and not rock back and fourth like it does. Maybe since it can't turn past TDC, it atoumatically disengages and then reengages since my thumb is keeping the ignition switched depressed?
No water or oil comes out of the sprakplug holes when turning over with the plugs out.
Thanks for the input and poease let me know if you can think of anything else.
I tried turning the motor over with the sparkplug wires plugged into the factory posts at the starter solenoid so the engine would have no spark at all. Still it would not turn over. I pulled the plugs and the engine turned over fine. I tried with just one plug screwed n the head and it would still not turn over. I took another compression test, both cylinders are at 115psi. When I put it back together. It turned over like it supposed to with the plugs in and wires connected. I was suprised when this happened and let off the starter switch. When I tried it again, it went back to the same thing where it only turns over about 1/4 turn.
Are these starters known for having problems? I was thinking maybe voltage drop in the wiring so I took a pair of jumper cables and went from the battery to the starter post and grounded the negative side to the block. Still the starter turned over 1/4 of a turn then stops.
I may have left one thing out. When I push the igintion switch, and the starter turns the engine 1/4 of a turn; it does this constantly if I dont let go of the switch. I looked at the drive shaft and it turns about 1/4 of a turn, the goes back to its original position and continues this motion if I don't let go of the iginition switch. I was thinking if the starter didn't have enough energy to push the pistion past TDC, then it would just hold it where it would max out on energy and not rock back and fourth like it does. Maybe since it can't turn past TDC, it atoumatically disengages and then reengages since my thumb is keeping the ignition switched depressed?
No water or oil comes out of the sprakplug holes when turning over with the plugs out.
Thanks for the input and poease let me know if you can think of anything else.
After reading many posts with similar problems, I reached in the engine compartment and turned the drive shaft by hand past TDC 3-4 times. When I engaged the igintion switch, the engine turned over and started right up. I am concluding this is either a tired starter or too much resistance in the wiring.
Thanks for your replies!
Thanks for your replies!
purple_people_eater
New Member
it's most likely carrosion in the wires or, if the motor has not been run in a while, the piston rings could have been stuck. also if that 115 psi compression is right, your going to need a top end soon. but then again if it has not been run in a while that could be causing it as well, but keep an eye on it.
- BiRkS_
Active Member
if its a failing solonoid, jump the two large posts with something metal (scewdriver) and see if the engine cranks normally. if it does, its a solonoid, if not, its a starter/wiring. I can bet your starter is worn out. a brush kit is only approx 20$ but you'll have to open up the starter first to make sure the armature isn't burned out.
- BiRkS_
Active Member
If the engine has 145 psi why would you pull the engine? a rebuilt engine is 150-155 psi....there is nothing wrong with your engine unless its seized/failing bearing. if you can manually rotate the engine a full revolution without hearing/feeling any grinding, then there is nothing wrong with it. It could be your starter, wires, connections, solonoid. -I dont see much point tearing appart a perfect motor. If anything go through the carbs and rebuild them since they're out. Other than that, i'd throw the engine back in the ski and work on the starting system.
purple_people_eater
New Member
the problems that cuase these issues are as follow and should be checked in this order:
1. battery, make sure it can hold 12.2 volt under load
2. wires
3. turn pto by hand
4. solenoid
5. starter.
our engine with one plug in it would turn over and almost start...then we put the second plug in all the way and it cranked over and fired. however with both plugs all the way tight and plug wires on i would hold the start button in and it would do the same 1/4 turn deal with the crank and go back to the original starting point along with the clicking (same problem as the guy who started this post). PTO is what? the crank im assuming..
- BiRkS_
Active Member
PTO= Power take off. Its the round flywheel type thing at the back of the engine that the pump drive shaft slides into. There are no "main" or "rod" bearings in these engines. The bearings are pressed in and the rods use needle bearings. If the bearings are done, your better off buying a re-man crank.
purple_people_eater
New Member
what about the pump you got to remeber on these its a direct line from engine to pump, if the pump is "dragging" then your motor will to. many costomers bring skis to me with "engine problems" and it actually pump problems
I had this problem two years ago on my 96 XP. Issue was I had the battery out of the pwc using 12ft 6AWG jumper cables (I think). The increased resistance in the cables was enough to get exactly what you describe. It was not the battery, I even jumped it off a car battery (not running) and same thing. Simply bringing the battery in the ski and hooking up the short smaller gauge wires fixed it.
In my opinion, its a bad design with not enough power to really turn the motor over with any margin. Therefore any increased resistance may be too much.
Interestingly I just winterized the xp a week ago and tried jumping the ski with an external battery. Suprisingly it worked. Not sure how it got "better" over two years.
Check all your connections twice and make them perfect. That may involve pulling the starter to clean up the ground connection. I have always thought about doubling the size of my cables to the battery because of this problem.
In my opinion, its a bad design with not enough power to really turn the motor over with any margin. Therefore any increased resistance may be too much.
Interestingly I just winterized the xp a week ago and tried jumping the ski with an external battery. Suprisingly it worked. Not sure how it got "better" over two years.
Check all your connections twice and make them perfect. That may involve pulling the starter to clean up the ground connection. I have always thought about doubling the size of my cables to the battery because of this problem.
Wow, you guys are great! I just bought these skis yesterday, had a starting problem with one of them and joined this site- what feedback. Thank you to everyone.
I temporarily installed a dedicated 4 guage wire from the positve lead of the battery to the starter and another from the negative to the block. This would eliminate many of the proposed hypothesis. Again, still the same problem. I am concluding either the starter or the possibility of the pump creating too much resistance. I pulled the starter and inspected it. I feel a type of grinding with the bendix when fully extended while turning the drive gear. I beleive this to be a starter problem from here. I am going to order a new starter and will post the results. I have read many threads on the available starters out there. Stay away from the chinese products and go OEM if possible. Well, OEM is going to cost me close to what I paid for the doulbe trailer alone. I bought both skis and the trailer for less than 4K and don't want to get carried away. DBelectric seemed to have more positve reviews than negative so I am going to order a new starter tomorrow and will let you all know the results.
Thanks again to everyone who replied. I am blown away by everyone's responses. You guys are awesome!
I temporarily installed a dedicated 4 guage wire from the positve lead of the battery to the starter and another from the negative to the block. This would eliminate many of the proposed hypothesis. Again, still the same problem. I am concluding either the starter or the possibility of the pump creating too much resistance. I pulled the starter and inspected it. I feel a type of grinding with the bendix when fully extended while turning the drive gear. I beleive this to be a starter problem from here. I am going to order a new starter and will post the results. I have read many threads on the available starters out there. Stay away from the chinese products and go OEM if possible. Well, OEM is going to cost me close to what I paid for the doulbe trailer alone. I bought both skis and the trailer for less than 4K and don't want to get carried away. DBelectric seemed to have more positve reviews than negative so I am going to order a new starter tomorrow and will let you all know the results.
Thanks again to everyone who replied. I am blown away by everyone's responses. You guys are awesome!
Before buying a new one get the OEM one rebuilt or do it yourself with the proper kits.
Search the thread for more help on this.
Search the thread for more help on this.
El Toro 33809
Well-Known Member
In regards to the gray fuel lines, they deteriorate from the insides due to ethanol in the fuel these days. This in turn can cause the fuel system to clog, make the PWC run poor or even cause engine failure. Clean the carbs and replace the fuel lines. There are loads of threads offering tips on fuel line replacement. Good luck.
Actually I dont believe its ethanol. I live in MN and we were one of the first to use Ethanol....and I have yet to run into rotted lines. I do however see the green goo from the lines reacting with the brass nipples.
My theory is not ethanol, but the additives that the gas manufacturers are putting in the gas which makes it a regional thing.
Never the less...I always replace the lines.
purple_people_eater
New Member
i agree, ive never run into green goo in the middle of lines, its always where the grey lines contact the bress on the carbs/fuel selector nipples.
I second the rebuilding the starter yourself. It's really not too hard and you may not even need to buy any new parts, just clean it up a bit. If I remember correctly, re-assembling the cover with the brushes was a bit difficult and I needed a second person and some small screwdrivers/picks. With that it took 2 minutes. Other than that, everything was simple. You might as well take it apart and see what it looks like before buying a new OEM. The postive terminal on the starter also is a bad design. I remember if I torqued the positive lug down, it would keep spinning and eventually short to ground. I ended up putting two lock nuts on the post and tightening between each other. I'm not sure how other people dealt with this since I never heard it complained about.
I was one of the people to complain about the DB electrical starters. My DB starter lasted about 1 month. I recently replied to my forum post indicating that my OEM died again two years later. The bendix was entirely rusted up. So, I tend to think I have some other moisture getting in there causing the starter to die early.
I was one of the people to complain about the DB electrical starters. My DB starter lasted about 1 month. I recently replied to my forum post indicating that my OEM died again two years later. The bendix was entirely rusted up. So, I tend to think I have some other moisture getting in there causing the starter to die early.
- Status
