97 xp won't crank when warm

[XP 787]

Hi everyone, having an issue with my 97 XP with the 787. It runs fine and cranks great but when cold but after it has warmed up from riding about a half hour or so it won't turn over if I shut it down then try and restart it. Not all the time though it's just once in awhile. I've tried turning the PTO by hand and it won't spin but if I rock it back with channel locks It will break free then start. I've also replaced the starter with an SBT which turns it over much better and also cleaned ground and positive cables. Previous owner changed the starter solenoid last year (I have all old receipts). Any ideas? This has me baffled and I don't want to keep having an issue like this while in the middle of the lake. Thanks for the help in advance.

 

[1983]

I guess we can delve into the carbs. What is history of them being rebuilt/gone through? You may have a possible rich condition which floods engine and makes it hard to start after riding. May need needles and seats adjusted or replaced in carbs.

 

[mikidymac]

I think the bigger issue than carbs is the the engine will not turn over "by hand" but will with "channel locks". Sounds like the engine might be seizing and locking up when hot.

You will have to do a compression check before we can help you any further.

Yes, the cause of the seizing is probably fuel related.

 

[ricardo1]

When you are riding does it feel normal? or it starts running poorly after a period of time?

 

[XP 787]

Sorry should have been a little more specific. Carbs have been rebuilt last year along with SBT motor all with receipts. don't think its a carb issue because once it cranks it starts and runs fine. Cranking when warm is the actual issue. I fell off one day and went to start it, it started cranking then stopped, not because I released the start button. Rocked the pto back and forth then I heard something release from the starter. Also yes runs fine no issues or hickups. Just cranking when warm. Also its not all the time because I have ridden for almost an hour straight one time fell off and it started fine. I will do a compression test this afternoon and get back to you guys.

 

[XP 787]

Also, new clear fuel lines.

 

[mikidymac]

It is stating to sound like a crap SBT starter to me. Once they get hot they work harder and sounds like it might be landing an a bad spot.
Do you still have the OEM starter?

 

[XP 787]

Yes I do. The old one is an 8 tooth and the SBT is a 9. The old starter did the same thing when warm that's why I thought it was the starter and replaced it.

 

[mikidymac]

I am not sure on the tooth count but for $20 you can replace the brushes on the OEM starter and that will take care of most but not all starter issues.
Lot of people here have had bad luck with the SBT and china made starters.

 

[XP 787]

ok thanks ill give that a try.

 

[CReynoldsMIZ]

I had that exact same problem with my 97 xp. It seemed like it happened more often when my battery wasn't fully juiced. When I put a new fresh battery in it seemed like it helped

 

[Coastiejoe]

OEM starter is the way to go. Put a brush kit on it and reinstall it. Then go from there.


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[1983]

By carbs, meaning engine is flooding due to issue with carbs. It is hydro-locking with fuel possibly.


Rob

I think the bigger issue than carbs is the the engine will not turn over "by hand" but will with "channel locks". Sounds like the engine might be seizing and locking up when hot.

You will have to do a compression check before we can help you any further.

Yes, the cause of the seizing is probably fuel related.

 

[1983]

So you did not let off of start button and engine stopped cranking on its own....?

Sorry should have been a little more specific. Carbs have been rebuilt last year along with SBT motor all with receipts. don't think its a carb issue because once it cranks it starts and runs fine. Cranking when warm is the actual issue. I fell off one day and went to start it, it started cranking then stopped, not because I released the start button. Rocked the pto back and forth then I heard something release from the starter. Also yes runs fine no issues or hickups. Just cranking when warm. Also its not all the time because I have ridden for almost an hour straight one time fell off and it started fine. I will do a compression test this afternoon and get back to you guys.

 

[XP 787]

So you did not let off of start button and engine stopped cranking on its own....?

Correct I did not let off the start button just stopped cranking on it's own. Didn't even start cranking slow just suddenly stopped then I realized PTO wouldn't turn but then when I'd turn it with the channel locks a little bit it would crank and start like nothing had happened and then run just fine.

 

[Coastiejoe]

Everything you are describing sounds like a poor connection and or bad starteer. I know you have gone through a few things trying to solve this, but I think you really should remove all the main battery and starter wires and check them out VERY well. Wiggle the ends once you have it in your hand. If they crunch or crumble or white powder comes out, they are junk. I would also pull the aftermarket starter and rebuild your OEM. There is a good chance you are fighting more than one issue here..

 

[XP 787]

Is there a certain brand rebuild kit to use? Or is anyone ok? When I replaced the starter I did sandpaper the end of the ground wire and the part of the starter which it bolts to because it was painted black. POS terminal looked ok but I never did inspect the whole wire of anything. Also when I do end up installing the rebuilt oem starter is it a good idea to look in and check out the flywheel? Could that also cause a jam when warm? Is it even possible for a stuck starter in the flywheel to cause the engine to lock up?

 

[mikidymac]

Look at the threads today, Minnetonka is making awesome better than OEM cables and I just asked how much for the 1997+ XP's.
For the brushes order them from Crank "n" Charge on Amazon, $21 shipped.

 

[XP 787]

Look at the threads today, Minnetonka is making awesome better than OEM cables and I just asked how much for the 1997+ XP's.
For the brushes order them from Crank "n" Charge on Amazon, $21 shipped.

ok cool, I saw the brush kit on amazon also.

 

[XP 787]

Found the issue. The other day I took it out on the lake and it was running and starting fine. Put it up on the trailer go to start it and its jammed up again. This time instead of trying to turn the pto I just brought it back to my shop and left it till the morning. So the next day I pull the front mag cover to inspect whats going on with the starter. I find a broken bolt head floating around in there and the starter gear stuck on the flywheel. I pull the starter and another broken bolt head falls out this was jamming the starter against the flywheel. So I flip over the mag cover and notice a bracket hung up on the stator wire. The two bolts hold that bracket on. So 2 new bolts, locktite, and about 3 hours of my time (never done this before) and problem solved. Thankyou everyone for the replies.

 

[Coastiejoe]

Very good,,, Glad you found and fixed the issue...

 

[1983]

Sweet, put some hours on it this summer :thumbsup:

 

[XP 787]

Sweet, put some hours on it this summer :thumbsup:

Lol I plan to, took it out yesterday and it ran great!