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RESTO 95 XP Partial Restore (multi topics)
- Thread starter Kal Brigger
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Kal Brigger
New Member
The owner's manual says to gap them at .20 - .24
Out of the box, they were .30
Out of the box, they were .30
Just test it without it working. Make the tool in the following link and you can swap it out without removing the pump.
http://www.seadooforum.com/showthread.php?81477-VTS-Nut-wrench&p=497968&viewfull=1#post497968
Kal Brigger
New Member
It's no biggie. Can't try it out until after the part comes in anyway, stupid work getting in the way.
Kal Brigger
New Member
Hopefully this won't start a huge, crazy discussion but I'm tired of reading 100 threads spanning the last 10 years and still not getting ONE definitive answer.
Neither me or the previous owner knows what kind of oil is in this 717. It's been topped off with blueish green oil for the past couple of years under a tarp.
I just changed and primed the small and mid-sized lines including a new oil filter.
I skipped replacing the 2 larger lines because they looked good and had the newer style screw clamps on the tank side of both lines making me think they might have been changed already.
My local parts store buddy sold me a gallon of the TC-W3 (which I now know shouldn't be used- and I haven't opened it yet either).
What I do know:
Don't use TW-3
Must be API-TC
Preferably Mineral oil (since it's a 717 and not bigger)
Looking at the top of the pistons through the plug holes, they're not smooth but not bad either- typical 19 year old accumulation I would say.
Apparently the good stuff is stupid expensive and sometimes hard to find (although I haven't shopped all my local stores yet to see whats available)
I'm not a die-hard purist but I don't want to screw something up
What I don't know:
1-A. Do I really need to completely drain the entire system (I've read mention of using shop vac, etc.) and start fresh- I'll admit this sounds the smartest but most time consuming
1-B. If I do, do I need to change oil filters again- this new filter has literally less than a minute of use on it.
1-C. What about the oil still in the motor, pump?
1-D. I've read that "continue using what the ski is used to using" But w/o knowing what's in it...
2. Can I just suck out a good majority of the oil in the tank and add new stuff to tank? Keeping in mind, this is the wife's ski and she's not going to be anywhere near WOT for a couple of tanks of gas until she gets used to it.
3. If for some reason I can't find mineral oil, can I go with full synth or blend? Or should I sell one of my kids and order it online?
4. I'd like to have the same oil for both the XP and my 1100 ZXi Jetski- is this possible?
5. Should I be worried about the ZXi oil system also?
Neither me or the previous owner knows what kind of oil is in this 717. It's been topped off with blueish green oil for the past couple of years under a tarp.
I just changed and primed the small and mid-sized lines including a new oil filter.
I skipped replacing the 2 larger lines because they looked good and had the newer style screw clamps on the tank side of both lines making me think they might have been changed already.
My local parts store buddy sold me a gallon of the TC-W3 (which I now know shouldn't be used- and I haven't opened it yet either).
What I do know:
Don't use TW-3
Must be API-TC
Preferably Mineral oil (since it's a 717 and not bigger)
Looking at the top of the pistons through the plug holes, they're not smooth but not bad either- typical 19 year old accumulation I would say.
Apparently the good stuff is stupid expensive and sometimes hard to find (although I haven't shopped all my local stores yet to see whats available)
I'm not a die-hard purist but I don't want to screw something up
What I don't know:
1-A. Do I really need to completely drain the entire system (I've read mention of using shop vac, etc.) and start fresh- I'll admit this sounds the smartest but most time consuming
1-B. If I do, do I need to change oil filters again- this new filter has literally less than a minute of use on it.
1-C. What about the oil still in the motor, pump?
1-D. I've read that "continue using what the ski is used to using" But w/o knowing what's in it...
2. Can I just suck out a good majority of the oil in the tank and add new stuff to tank? Keeping in mind, this is the wife's ski and she's not going to be anywhere near WOT for a couple of tanks of gas until she gets used to it.
3. If for some reason I can't find mineral oil, can I go with full synth or blend? Or should I sell one of my kids and order it online?
4. I'd like to have the same oil for both the XP and my 1100 ZXi Jetski- is this possible?
5. Should I be worried about the ZXi oil system also?
I can answer your questions once and for all. The seadoo uses a rotary valve that needs to be lubricated as well as the pistons and bearings. The seadoos make more power per cc than the other brands and thus require a different spec oil, API-TC. Seadoo did a lot of testing back in the day and found that with their engines the TCW and outboard oils would not provide the lubricating properties they required so they use the API-TC. Now, because your 717 doesn't have power valves it can use any API-TC rated oil, be it mineral, semi or full synthetic.
No you can't mix the oils as they ca gel and clog the oil system. We have had members here see it happen.
Yes, you need to drain the oil tank and suck out as much oil as you can from the big oil lines going into the crankcase.
Yes you need to replace your oil filter, again. Sorry.
No, you cant use the same oil in your seadoo and Kawasaki as they both require different spec oils.
It the oil is blue or green it is the wrong oil for your seadoo.
No, dont continue to use the wrong oil just because the person before you did the wrong thing.
Some members here have had the TCW oils cause the inner crank seals to leak.
Basically if you want that thing to live spend $45 and do it the correct way.
No, the oil isn't hard to find or expensive.
Just checked Amazon.............
Sea-Doo XP-S 2 Stroke Mineral Oil - 1 gallon
by Sea-Doo
4.8 out of 5 stars 19 customer reviews
Price: $34.99 & FREE Shipping
Only 20 left in stock.
Estimated Delivery Date: May 9 - 12 when you choose Standard at checkout.
Ships from and sold by LNPS.
Kawasaki oil system is probably fine but not as reliable as the seadoo's. If it has an oil filter I would replace it too.
No you can't mix the oils as they ca gel and clog the oil system. We have had members here see it happen.
Yes, you need to drain the oil tank and suck out as much oil as you can from the big oil lines going into the crankcase.
Yes you need to replace your oil filter, again. Sorry.
No, you cant use the same oil in your seadoo and Kawasaki as they both require different spec oils.
It the oil is blue or green it is the wrong oil for your seadoo.
No, dont continue to use the wrong oil just because the person before you did the wrong thing.
Some members here have had the TCW oils cause the inner crank seals to leak.
Basically if you want that thing to live spend $45 and do it the correct way.
No, the oil isn't hard to find or expensive.
Just checked Amazon.............
Sea-Doo XP-S 2 Stroke Mineral Oil - 1 gallon
by Sea-Doo
4.8 out of 5 stars 19 customer reviews
Price: $34.99 & FREE Shipping
Only 20 left in stock.
Estimated Delivery Date: May 9 - 12 when you choose Standard at checkout.
Ships from and sold by LNPS.
Kawasaki oil system is probably fine but not as reliable as the seadoo's. If it has an oil filter I would replace it too.
Last edited by a moderator:
Kal Brigger
New Member
Sounds good enough for me.
I'll buy 2 oil filters today to replace both ski's filters and just go ahead and fully change both oil systems to be sure.
Now, since I'm sucking out the old oil- where is the best spot to do so?
Obviously for the tank, I'm going to use a store bought siphon pump thingy to get the majority out.
1. The big lines going under the motor look to be a P.I.T.A. to get to so I'm hoping there is an easier location. I'm thinking I can hook the shop vac up to the tank side of those lines and the medium sized line (after taking off oil filter)?
2. Is there any prep for the shop vac that needs to be done besides installing the wet/vac filter on it?
3. What about the oil still in the motor and pump? I'm not taking those little injector lines off again!!
4. Do I need to do some kind of wash/cleaning for the tank (how thorough of a cleaning do I need to do)?
I'll buy 2 oil filters today to replace both ski's filters and just go ahead and fully change both oil systems to be sure.
Now, since I'm sucking out the old oil- where is the best spot to do so?
Obviously for the tank, I'm going to use a store bought siphon pump thingy to get the majority out.
1. The big lines going under the motor look to be a P.I.T.A. to get to so I'm hoping there is an easier location. I'm thinking I can hook the shop vac up to the tank side of those lines and the medium sized line (after taking off oil filter)?
2. Is there any prep for the shop vac that needs to be done besides installing the wet/vac filter on it?
3. What about the oil still in the motor and pump? I'm not taking those little injector lines off again!!
4. Do I need to do some kind of wash/cleaning for the tank (how thorough of a cleaning do I need to do)?
Shortrun
Well-Known Member
To be honest i have not done this on a seadoo, but on ski doo i have.
I just syphon the oil out or the tank, that gets almost every thing out.
For the rotary valve chamber, i wonder if you could just take the 2 hoses off the tank. Then tip the entire ski on its side. Just a thought, i have never needed to do this part.
I am assuming the ski is on the ground for this.
I just syphon the oil out or the tank, that gets almost every thing out.
For the rotary valve chamber, i wonder if you could just take the 2 hoses off the tank. Then tip the entire ski on its side. Just a thought, i have never needed to do this part.
I am assuming the ski is on the ground for this.
Last edited by a moderator:
If you blow into the hose connected to the top of the tank it will force almost all the oil out of the motor. Then clamp it off. Dump tank, clean and fill it with fresh oil.
CReynoldsMIZ
Well-Known Member
Here is how I always change out my oil. Very easy no mess at all.
1) Go buy yourself one of these very cheap "fluid transfer pumps" from Harbor Freight or Walmart. Like 7 bucks and use it all the time.
http://www.harborfreight.com/multi-use-transfer-pump-66418.html
2) Put the pump together, stick the end of the tube that says "in" down deep into the oil tank as far as you can, try and feed it to the deepest side, and pump all that oil out into an old gallon jug.
3) Remove the clamp on the big oil tube return line that attaches to the top of the oil tank. Shove that same transfer pump tube inside of that line (it should barely fit inside) and then that will suck whatever remaining oil you have left in the engine and both of the big oil lines.
4) Now that you have all of the oil out of the system, go ahead and disconnect the lines that go to the oil pump and the other big tube, and remove the oil tank, dump a little gas in there to clean it out really good, then reinstall everything and you should be good to go with no old oil residue or any worries about oils getting mixed together.
I cant stress how easy it is, if you do it right you shouldn't make any kind of a mess at all.
1) Go buy yourself one of these very cheap "fluid transfer pumps" from Harbor Freight or Walmart. Like 7 bucks and use it all the time.
http://www.harborfreight.com/multi-use-transfer-pump-66418.html
2) Put the pump together, stick the end of the tube that says "in" down deep into the oil tank as far as you can, try and feed it to the deepest side, and pump all that oil out into an old gallon jug.
3) Remove the clamp on the big oil tube return line that attaches to the top of the oil tank. Shove that same transfer pump tube inside of that line (it should barely fit inside) and then that will suck whatever remaining oil you have left in the engine and both of the big oil lines.
4) Now that you have all of the oil out of the system, go ahead and disconnect the lines that go to the oil pump and the other big tube, and remove the oil tank, dump a little gas in there to clean it out really good, then reinstall everything and you should be good to go with no old oil residue or any worries about oils getting mixed together.
I cant stress how easy it is, if you do it right you shouldn't make any kind of a mess at all.
Kal Brigger
New Member
Wow! You guys make it sound a lot easier than I was picturing!!
Now I'm not dreading it.
I'll let you know how it comes out.
Now I just gotta find some oil tomorrow. Good thing about my job. I can go shopping around at the parts store without the boss caring.
Now I'm not dreading it.
I'll let you know how it comes out.
Now I just gotta find some oil tomorrow. Good thing about my job. I can go shopping around at the parts store without the boss caring.
Kal Brigger
New Member
So I pumped the tank, sucked out what I could from the lines, threw away the old filter, removed the tank, cleaned it out twice with some gas, blew that out with air, used mouth to blow into big line that connects on top of tank and caught what was coming out of the other big hose in an old oil quart, replaced everything and installed new filter.
I think I'm good to go other than a little bit of old oil seeping back into the big hoses after sitting for a little while.
It was weird having a blueish green oil coming out of the tank but the oil coming out of the motor and pump was purple.
Not sure what that's about.
I'm working on a way to better secure the new battery. The original tray is for a larger battery than what I have in there (not sure of the brand but it's a sealed battery).
Used Magic Eraser on the old yellow hood- wow! That was super quick and easy!
Started to strip the old registration numbers off to prep for good cleaning and waxing. After that, I'm going to paint the bumpers and see how that goes. I did paint and body for a little while so I'm fairly confident I can get them to look good without removing them.
I also started taking off the old purple, bacon shaped foot pads by drilling out the pop rivets and pushing them through the hull. I'm trying to figure out if I should seal all those little holes before gluing down the new pads or not. Maybe using the foot pad glue to seal them and stick the pads down at the same time...
I have to find a good glue and some way of weighting the new/used pads down evenly.
The search continues for a local supplier of API-TC oil. My normal auto parts supplier's catalog has Quicksilver but only TC-W3.
Wal-Mart, Auto Zone and O'Riellys don't have it either (at least on the shelf or within a few days delivery time).
There is a Mercury shop about 1/2 hour away. I'll call them in the morning to see if they have some.
Next closest option is about an hour out of the way.
Trying to get some quickly so I can at least water test it this Saturday. Then I can buy it off Amazon if local source is too stupid expensive (I don't mind paying a little extra locally but too much is too much).
And that's today's update...
I think I'm good to go other than a little bit of old oil seeping back into the big hoses after sitting for a little while.
It was weird having a blueish green oil coming out of the tank but the oil coming out of the motor and pump was purple.
Not sure what that's about.
I'm working on a way to better secure the new battery. The original tray is for a larger battery than what I have in there (not sure of the brand but it's a sealed battery).
Used Magic Eraser on the old yellow hood- wow! That was super quick and easy!
Started to strip the old registration numbers off to prep for good cleaning and waxing. After that, I'm going to paint the bumpers and see how that goes. I did paint and body for a little while so I'm fairly confident I can get them to look good without removing them.
I also started taking off the old purple, bacon shaped foot pads by drilling out the pop rivets and pushing them through the hull. I'm trying to figure out if I should seal all those little holes before gluing down the new pads or not. Maybe using the foot pad glue to seal them and stick the pads down at the same time...
I have to find a good glue and some way of weighting the new/used pads down evenly.
The search continues for a local supplier of API-TC oil. My normal auto parts supplier's catalog has Quicksilver but only TC-W3.
Wal-Mart, Auto Zone and O'Riellys don't have it either (at least on the shelf or within a few days delivery time).
There is a Mercury shop about 1/2 hour away. I'll call them in the morning to see if they have some.
Next closest option is about an hour out of the way.
Trying to get some quickly so I can at least water test it this Saturday. Then I can buy it off Amazon if local source is too stupid expensive (I don't mind paying a little extra locally but too much is too much).
And that's today's update...
Fill the holes. I use bondo glass and bought it at Wal-Mart. It comes in a quart, you'll have a quart left over. Look in my 95xp800 build thread, I used making tape and a hole punch to keep the mess to a minimum.it's towards the end of the thread. Just order the oil on line, if you want to ride your wasting time. Or check Wal-Mart, some seek quicksilver semi-synth that is api,tc rated
Kal Brigger
New Member
I have some "Fiber-Fill" I got at Napa for a couple of scratches and one good sized spot on the hull.
The gel coat has fallen off and I can see the fiberglass layer underneath. A couple of guys that have been boating for a long time said they're not too bad but I'm going to fix them anyway.
A few long scratches, about 1/2" wide and a couple feet long. The worst spot is about 3" by 1 1/2" and fairly deep, maybe 1/4".
The gel coat has fallen off and I can see the fiberglass layer underneath. A couple of guys that have been boating for a long time said they're not too bad but I'm going to fix them anyway.
A few long scratches, about 1/2" wide and a couple feet long. The worst spot is about 3" by 1 1/2" and fairly deep, maybe 1/4".
Kal Brigger
New Member
As soon as I get a chance, I'll upload some.
Kal Brigger
New Member
Well, found some Quicksilver PWC for $33 a gallon.
Bought 2 and the salesman talked me into buying 2 fire extinguishers, a new replacement roll of carpet for the trailer's skids and some kind of fuel treatment stuff.
Hoping to get home to a pile of parts from Minnetonka4me and get her ready to test.
After this much $$ and time invested, I might as well keep these skis instead of trying to sell/trade them off like I originally planned.
I guess this summer will help me decide.
Bought 2 and the salesman talked me into buying 2 fire extinguishers, a new replacement roll of carpet for the trailer's skids and some kind of fuel treatment stuff.
Hoping to get home to a pile of parts from Minnetonka4me and get her ready to test.
After this much $$ and time invested, I might as well keep these skis instead of trying to sell/trade them off like I originally planned.
I guess this summer will help me decide.
Make sure the Quicksilver is API-TC rated if it just says PWC or TCW-3 anywhere it is not correct. They make both.
Also keep in mind that if you are going to switch to the actual Seadoo brand you will have to drain and flush again. You can't mix 2 different brands of oil.
Also keep in mind that if you are going to switch to the actual Seadoo brand you will have to drain and flush again. You can't mix 2 different brands of oil.
Kal Brigger
New Member
Kal Brigger
New Member
So I stumbled onto this old forum post
http://seadoosportboats.com/topic/846-2-cycle-rotax-oil-brand-list/
and then went to Quicksilver's website to get more info on the oil I bought.
https://www.quicksilver-products.com/en/products/marine/personal-watercraft/lubricant/lubricant/
The post says Quicksilver's PWC oil is "good" (which is fine with me at the moment) but it states "PWC 2 cycle oil, API TC".
No where on the bottle OR their website about this oil does it specifically say "API-TC".
It also does not say "TW-C3".
So... will it work?
I haven't poured it in yet, waiting on confirmation before I do.
http://seadoosportboats.com/topic/846-2-cycle-rotax-oil-brand-list/
and then went to Quicksilver's website to get more info on the oil I bought.
https://www.quicksilver-products.com/en/products/marine/personal-watercraft/lubricant/lubricant/
The post says Quicksilver's PWC oil is "good" (which is fine with me at the moment) but it states "PWC 2 cycle oil, API TC".
No where on the bottle OR their website about this oil does it specifically say "API-TC".
It also does not say "TW-C3".
So... will it work?
I haven't poured it in yet, waiting on confirmation before I do.
Somewhere on here there is a thread about quicksilver oil. Unless it says api-tc I wouldn't use it. They're basically trying to make one oil that covers everything. When I first mentioned the quicksilver I also said make sure it says api-tc. I'll assume there it's not a Seadoo dealer near by. Wal-Mart sells the quicksilver, well some do, mine doesn't buy other members here have lucked out. Our just prefer the Seadoo oil online and miss this weekend. Don't forget to bleed your oil pump.
Kal Brigger
New Member
So here's what my local Walmart has (according to online).
It makes no mention of TC-W3 but does mention "engineered for air or liquid cooled watercraft engines or engines which specify the use of API-TC type oils."
This sounds more like what I need. I'll use the Quicksilver in the JetSki.
The only 2 reviews it has are negative.
One review says it fouled out his Polaris snowmobile plugs and the other likes it but Walmart doesn't keep it on stock on the shelves.
The one from walmart with the yellow label is ok to use in your ski and is approved. The problem from what I can tell is that Quicksilver has discontinued that oil and moved to the "Multi-Brand" which is not good for your ski. There is no such thing is one oil for all so I would not use it in my Doo. Their website doesn't even list the yellow label stuff any more.
Also like I said if you can find it and start using that yellow label Quicksilver you will have to drain and flush your oil system and change the oil filter again. You can't mix two different brands.
Also like I said if you can find it and start using that yellow label Quicksilver you will have to drain and flush your oil system and change the oil filter again. You can't mix two different brands.
Kal Brigger
New Member
VTS update:
Received new VTS module from Minnetonka and temporarily hooked it up to see how it worked. It just clicked like my original.
I know my new motor was good since I ran it straight off the battery in both directions.
I also knew the new module was good since Minnetonka tested it before he shipped it.
So I dug a little deeper, into the fuse box. The inside was spotless and dry and missing the fuse for the VTS.
Replaced it with a 7.5 fuse and now both modules work.
Lesson of the day: A bad/missing fuse can still cause the module to click. Check the easy/cheap stuff first.
After installing the new boot (which was a P.I.T.A.) and the new style clamps, the trim ran up and down like it was supposed to.
I filled her up with Seadoo XP-S oil (yes, I did the 2 hour trip to my nearest Seadoo dealer and bought the correct stuff so I know I'll always be able to get the correct stuff in the future).
It was a little difficult to see it flowing through the hoses and injection lines since it's a clear/yellowish color instead of the old dark purple, but with a carefully placed light from my phone and looking for the tiny little bubbles, I knew they were primed and filled up properly.
Installed new fire extinguisher and holder (new extinguisher was too big to fit into original purple cylinder so I removed one to accommodate- pics soon).
Greased the trailer bearings and headed for the lake...
Received new VTS module from Minnetonka and temporarily hooked it up to see how it worked. It just clicked like my original.
I know my new motor was good since I ran it straight off the battery in both directions.
I also knew the new module was good since Minnetonka tested it before he shipped it.
So I dug a little deeper, into the fuse box. The inside was spotless and dry and missing the fuse for the VTS.
Replaced it with a 7.5 fuse and now both modules work.
Lesson of the day: A bad/missing fuse can still cause the module to click. Check the easy/cheap stuff first.
After installing the new boot (which was a P.I.T.A.) and the new style clamps, the trim ran up and down like it was supposed to.
I filled her up with Seadoo XP-S oil (yes, I did the 2 hour trip to my nearest Seadoo dealer and bought the correct stuff so I know I'll always be able to get the correct stuff in the future).
It was a little difficult to see it flowing through the hoses and injection lines since it's a clear/yellowish color instead of the old dark purple, but with a carefully placed light from my phone and looking for the tiny little bubbles, I knew they were primed and filled up properly.
Installed new fire extinguisher and holder (new extinguisher was too big to fit into original purple cylinder so I removed one to accommodate- pics soon).
Greased the trailer bearings and headed for the lake...
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