1997 Seadoo XP Project

[doberdann1019]

I was putting the finishing touches on the carb rebuild, cleaning the needles and replacing the o-rings. I originally did not want to touch the needles in fear of messing something up but decided I am better off with cleaning them and recalibrating everything. Even if it takes some time to learn how to.

3 of the 4 needles came out with no trouble, I cleaned out the jets with carb cleaner, cleaned the needles and replaced the o-rings. Here are some before pictures..



One of the washers was in bad shape but I could not find one which matched and would allow the needle to seat properly. For now, I just reused it.



The 4th needle (the high speed adjuster) does not want to come out. I almost stripped the head right off without even realizing it. The metal seems very soft for some reason. At this point a screwdriver is useless. I can still get vice grips on the head of the screw/needle but I am afraid that it will shear the head of the screw right off.



I do not want to break the needle but I do not want to leave it without cleaning the jet and readjusting the needle. I have tried soaking it with PB Blaster, maybe that will free it up.

Any suggestions?

 

[DA080682]

Last time I had the high speed screw seize I broke the head off trying to get it out, then I took my dremel and cut another notch and broke that off as well and I was flush with the collar on the carb body. At that point, the washer and spring slide off and I tapped a 12 point socket onto the remaining portion and was able to work it back and forth until it came out. Was not pretty but I don't think there is any other way. The screw is made of brass and is very soft. Good Luck.

 

[doberdann1019]

(I posted this in the main 2-stroke forum but wanted to put it in here for record keeping sake)

I have been working on a 1997 Seadoo XP and have been able to work through my problems on pretty much everything until now. I cannot get one of the high speed jet needles out of the threading. I was originally removing it to replace the o-ring and clean out any fuel line gunk, but at this point I need to get it out to replace the needle.

The three other needles came out with no problems, I could see the other high speed jet needle has some corrosion starting but the stuck one seems really bad.

The problems started when I first stripped out the flat head screwdriver slot then torqued off the needle head with some vice grips. I took a grinder to it to get the top washer and spring off then tried to get a small socket and pound it onto the needle stem but that just slipped around the stem. I used a pick and was able to get the bottom washer on o-ring out (in pieces). They were real tight which explains why the PB Blaster did nothing for me.

I then started to drill into the stem and attempted to use an extractor bit but that was useless. I've drilled about 1/2" into the stem (which probably wasn't a good idea). I also broke away some of the collar around the needle stem to get better access. (After the pictures were taken) I drilled perpendicular into the stem and stuck a pick through to try to get some more torque and turn it but the soft needle just snapped.

I'm stumped. Not sure what to do from here. The way I see it I have three options:

1 - Leave it, reinstall the carbs and hope it the needle is set right / see how it runs
2 - Buy a new carbs
3 - Keep drilling to China and hope something loosens up

Any advice?

Thanks

 

[sselzer]

I think you killed it.

 

[DSchmidt54]

Yeah , buy new carbs... i would never risk my engine on a screwed up needle ..... especially if its the high speed adjuster.

 

[DSchmidt54]

Yeah , buy new carbs... i would never risk my engine on a screwed up needle ..... especially if its the high speed adjuster.

Let me help ya out lol

[MENTION=41828]Minnetonka4me[/MENTION]
[MENTION=51350]Jetskigoodies[/MENTION]

If they don't have em , here you go

http://www.ebay.com/itm/SEADOO-GSX-..._Watercraft_Parts&hash=item27d226b779&vxp=mtr

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1997-SEADOO..._Watercraft_Parts&hash=item3ccff110b4&vxp=mtr

OOOooohhhh
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Buckshot-Mi..._Watercraft_Parts&hash=item27d2169a94&vxp=mtr

 

[DSchmidt54]

Note: the last set is not set for stock, they require special tuning , and added waterflow to the pipe.... they cost alot more because they are specifically for racing , if you get them... .make sure you do some research first..... i just posted them because they are rare... and shiny lol

 

[doberdann1019]

Thanks guys, I will do the right thing a get a new one. I don't want this new to me jet ski breaking down my first summer with it. I've put enough money and time into it, no going back now. Thanks

 

[mashenden]

...Any advice?

I got one loose by applying some heat (MAPP torch). Be careful no gas remains anywhere inside or around, though, for obvious reasons.

But in retrospect, I would replace them.

 

[doberdann1019]

Today I was able to to a bit more work on the ski (it has been tough finding time with work being crazy lately). I inspected the bailers, they looked pretty clean and not clogged but but there were leaves and debris under them. I also cleaned up the bailer hoses which were lose as the mounts had broke off the hull so I applied new ones.



Then I sealed up the fuel baffle access and reinstalled the seat, which was a pain in the ass. Luckily I had a buddy hold it while I installed the bolt into the shock. I need to clean the seat. I was planning on recovering it but have spent toooooo much $$ in the past 2 months of owning it and haven't even ridden it. I'll make sure she floats before doing any aesthetic work.



After that I ripped off the splash guard which was falling off. I don't plan on reinstalling it. I have heard that it's not really all the necessary - agree? I also have to put the plastic nose back on, the bolts were rusted bad and a couple of the holes were wrecked. I think I will just drill new holes and maybe reinforce them somehow.



I noticed that one of the air hoses which directs air to the rear side of the engine has a crack in it. I don't think it is all the bad but will try to patch it up with something.



And I have been putting it off but its about time that I fix the crack in the storage bin which sits over the engine. The crack is where the bottom of the fire extinguisher sits. I'm thinking epoxy.



I did end up buying new carbs (thanks Minnetonka4me) which should be here tomorrow so hopefully those will be in soon and I will have her running!

 

[doberdann1019]

New carbs showed up today. I stripped them down and put in all the new parts from the rebuild kits I bought and also replaced the springs, jets and needles with parts from my old carbs. The new carbs are a perfect match but I figured I'd be safe and use the old parts which have lived with the ski.

Now I have Franken-Carbs!



I did notice one thing different between the new and old carbs. On the old carbs, the small line which is used to move fuel from the accelerator pump seemed to have what I think is a check valve. This is not on the line of the new carbs. Anyone ever see this? And know which way is right? As of right now I did not use the check valve because I don't think the accelerator pump was working before I tore everything apart and less resistance in the line might help.

Also I think its a check valve because when I was spraying carb cleaner through it, flow would only go one direction. Check valve.

And after looking at the picture just now I see an arrow on it. Definitely Check Valve.

New (w/o check valve):

Old w/ check valve):

Tomorrow I will put the carbs on the engine, reinstall the oil tank and clean out the RAVEs. I need to order RAVE gaskets, o-rings and bellows but I will at least get a start on them. Hopefully she'll be running soon!

Oh, and I also recently got her a friend...

 

[mashenden]

...

Tomorrow I will put the carbs on the engine, reinstall the oil tank and clean out the RAVEs. I need to order RAVE gaskets, o-rings and bellows but I will at least get a start on them. Hopefully she'll be running soon!

Oh, and I also recently got her a friend...

View attachment 18685

Be sure to replace what appears to be gray lines on the new carb pics. You do not want any gray gas lines in the gas supply/return system, or for that matter within 100 mile radius of your jet ski if at all possible

If your jet ski gets chummy with the "new friend" you could end up with some sort of amphibious offspring. Imagine!! The neighbors will talk...

 

[doberdann1019]

Be sure to replace what appears to be gray lines on the new carb pics. You do not want any gray gas lines in the gas supply/return system, or for that matter within 100 mile radius of your jet ski if at all possible

If your jet ski gets chummy with the "new friend" you could end up with some sort of amphibious offspring. Imagine!! The neighbors will talk...

I did, no grey lines are to be seen anywhere on that jet ski now! The first picture was right out of the box. The new carbs got new lines and all/most of the internals.

And a jet ski and bike...aside from the fact that they are machines that sure would would be a sight.

 

[mashenden]

I did, no grey lines are to be seen anywhere on that jet ski now! The first picture was right out of the box. The new carbs got new lines and all/most of the internals.

And a jet ski and bike...aside from the fact that they are machines that sure would would be a sight.

Glad the greys are gone

 

[doberdann1019]

Yesterday I installed the new to the ski rebuilt carbs along with the new to the ski stock air filter (when I bought it there were K&N filters on but I went to the stock ones to keep water out better). Getting the bolts, carbs, gaskets and mounting holes all lined up was easier said than done, but after messing around for a little while I got it all tightened up. I hooked up all the fuel lines too, I had to adjust some of my hose clamps to get them to fit under the exhaust but I got it all in there.



Then I installed the air filter mount, flame arrestor and housing. Then I realized that I never connected the throttle, oil pump or choke cables to the carbs and took the air filter parts all off. :banghead:



The choke butterfly valve/discs had been removed on my old carbs, but I figured it may be nice sometime to have the choke so I hooked it up. The cable was a little rusty from not being used and tucked away in the hull but I cleaned it up and hopefully it doesn't fail anytime soon.



Once that was all wrapped up I hooked the oil tank back up and filled it. There is no fill line so I filled it about 1/3 to 3/4 of the way. Does that sound right?

 

[doberdann1019]

After that I put the front bumper back on. I used larger bolts than the originals because some of the holes had been stripped through so the smaller bolts wouldn't hold. If I do bump into anything I know I'll be okay, as for them...



I also reinstalled the front and rear vent lines and cleaned up all the lines/cables/wires in the hull best I could with zip ties.

 

[doberdann1019]

I was just about to trailer up and go get gas to fire her up when I decided I better clean the RAVEs out…

The rear rave came out fine. Dirty as hell, but out without breaking anything. The front, I had problems. The front-most screw holding the housing/cover on would not come out. I tried tapping it with a hammer, I sprayed PB Blaster penetrating oil and I tried gradually nudging the screw to break it lose. It never gave and eventually I torqued it right off. Then the housing, cap, bellows and valve all came out nicely.

 

[doberdann1019]

Luckily, the screw broke about 1/8” above the surface gasket surface. So my first thought was to take a hack saw and cut a slot into the screw to try and use a flat head screw driver to get it out. That along with a lot more PB Blaster and tapping with a hammer didn’t work. I might still try again with some heat this time.



I considered trying an easy-out but to drill straight into the screw would mean removing the exhaust elbow which is something I don’t really want to get into (but maybe will have to).



Then I started thinking about a way to fix it without getting the screw out. At first I thought about using an open threaded hole which seems to be extra (maybe used for a different exhaust manifold). The problem with that is it would apply uneven loading on the gasket and make getting the proper crush difficult/impossible.

 

[sselzer]

I would paint those new bumper bolts black. It would look alot better, just my opinion.

 

[doberdann1019]

Then I thought of the idea I am currently perusing. I used some JB Weld to secure a nut on top of the housing/cover. This is to thread a bolt into. I also used JB Weld to mount nuts to the side of the engine block directly below where my broken bolt is. I will then use a bracket to connect these two JB Welded nuts.



I think I will still have trouble getting a good crush on the gasket but I can build up washers under the bolts to create more compression. And I am thinking that I will need to run a steel line from the engine block mounted bolt down to another anchor for more support.

I have never used JB Weld so I am not sure if this little mod is really within the design limits of the glue, but I figure it’s worth a shot. I know what I should do, which is get the broken bolt out, but I want to try this out first. I believe the function of the hosing is to be a guide for the stem of the valve and a backstop to keep it from blowing out. So the main pressure on it is exhaust pressure. Also, pressure from the spring is acting against the housing. I cannot quantify the forces acting on it but let’s hope for my sake that they are smaller than the limits of the JB glue!

I also looked inside the valve slot and notices some scores on the front piston…



So who thinks this will fail and end up badly for me?

 

[doberdann1019]

I would paint those new bumper bolts black. It would look alot better, just my opinion.

I think I will, if I ever get this thing running.

 

[racerxxx]

Those bolts are supposed to be rivets with rubber caps to plug the holes, they weren't stripped out. Also, did you JB weld that nut to the housing to the broken screw?

Your best bet would be to get that apart NOW if you did, clean it up, get to a welder and have him TIG weld a nut to the broken screw and do it that way. JB ain't gonna hold while you rotate. It's needs to be welded, and since it's stainless, that means TIG. A $20 bill would probably cover it.

 

[doberdann1019]

Those bolts are supposed to be rivets with rubber caps to plug the holes, they weren't stripped out. Also, did you JB weld that nut to the housing to the broken screw?

Your best bet would be to get that apart NOW if you did, clean it up, get to a welder and have him TIG weld a nut to the broken screw and do it that way. JB ain't gonna hold while you rotate. It's needs to be welded, and since it's stainless, that means TIG. A $20 bill would probably cover it.

Hmmm, well they were bolts when I got to them. I guess someone before me had the thing off too.

You're right about the welding. Maybe this weekend I will try to, luckily in college I took a welding class off campus at a shop and the owner told us to come back anytime if we need some welding done. I might give him a call.

 

[doberdann1019]

After sleeping on it, I think I will just do the right thing. Remove the exhaust elbow, heat it up and try to use an easy out. If that doesn't work drill it out and install a heli-coil or tap it.

Or maybe weld a nut on top of the broken bolt and crank it out. Luckily it is sticking out a little (1/16 - 1/8")

 

[doberdann1019]

I got the exhaust head pipe off today. It is pretty dirty and I found some water/sludge in the connecting pipe cone. I don't think its anything to worry about.

Hopefully tomorrow I will have time to drill into the RAVE bolt with an easy out and see if I can get it out. I have some MAP gas and a torch which I want to use to try to heat it up. It might make it break lose easier, but I am a bit concerned with having a flame blowing into the exhaust through the RAVE slots. I doubt there is any gas but still on my mind. I have it all opened up to air out over night.