1995 XP - broken hose identification and fix help

[shattered00]

I was attempting to adjust the carbs' low and high speed adjusters and the idle adjuster when I noticed a broken piece of small diameter hose (previously painted white like the engine) laying in the hull. This is a hose that connects from the bottom of the engine (?) to another part lower on the engine. There is an identical hose that connects on the bow side of the engine (?) to another lower part. What does this part do, and is it likely that I will be able to find a replacement? Below are pictures. Thank you for any assistance.

 

[Ankeneyou]

That's the oil injection line that goes from the oil pump to the intake. If you've been running with that off, the PTO side piston/cylinder is very likely damaged.

The line size is 3/32 tygon tubing. You can get it online, at a lawnmower shop, or home depot has it as well.

 

[shattered00]

Thank you. It was on there prior to my last outing which lasted a total run time of about 2-3 hours. I know it was on there because the carbs were put back on and the hose was attached. I don;t know when it would have broken off during that outing though... I was getting significant surging/bogging at WOT and dying at idle without giving throttle, so I wonder if that could have been the problem and not the carbs needing tuning. Thank you for the quick reply. Should I try and replace it and then run the ski to see if the piston/cylinder is damaged or is there another way to check?

I am feeling like I need to take the entire engine apart assuming I didn't just ruin the ski and check to make sure there aren't any other brittle parts. Sad day.

 

[Ankeneyou]

The oil line coming off would have caused an air leak so could have contributed to poor running.

I'd do a compression test first and see what you've got. If that's good (150 psi is perfect on a 717, but the cylinders need to be within 10% of each other max) then I'd replace all oil lines and the oil filter. This includes the 3/32 lines and all lines going to from the oil tank to the oil pump as well as oil tank to the rotary valve cavity on the engine.

 

[mikidymac]

Those are your oil injection lines without them no lubrication oil.
Replace with 3/32" Tygon tubing.

 

[RodInEscondido]

Side note: you are subject to the fuel tank recall; call dealer with HIN and they can tell you if it has been done, if not it is a no-charge-to-you replacement. And as long as you are in there check for any of the old gray Tempo fuel lines; if they are there you need to replace them and clean out the fuel delivery system including the carbs; a lot of posts here on the stuff that needs to be done.

Here is wishing you luck.

 

[shattered00]

Thank you all! I am the least mechanically inclined person I know and without this forum I would be lost beyond help. I will check on the recall for my fuel tank for sure and wouldn't have ever known about it without ur post. my ultimate plan is to get the ski running optimally before winter and then take everything apart and paint because the engine has paint that is missing and rust in its place in about 1/6 of spots( mostly near where jt mounts to the hull). I wish I would have changed the needles and seats on the carb rebuild bht didn't know about that at the time. I did change all the fuel lines from grey to black but I missed one somehow they goes from bow side carb to engine sadly and will change it next. I plan on eventually doing a post to show he before and after but still a ways off. Will work on aesthetics once I get internsls squares away. I did jack this up changing out the start and vts button which were beyond degraded. Can't find cheap replacement uet

 

[Ankeneyou]

I'd suggest a compression test before you invest much more time and money. If that reveals a problem you then need to decide if it's worth going any further with a complete engine rebuild.

 

[shattered00]

Thank you, I am on way to get the gauge right now per your original post. It says 3/4 but the plug is 1/2 so I am going to use 1/2 inch adapter to be on safe side. Will post results.

 

[mikidymac]

You shouldn't need an adapter. It should look like this

 

[shattered00]

Got one that looks like that, thanks! I am not sure which one is pto but the one at stern is 150 on the nose after five tries and the one closer to the bow has varied from 130 to 150 with 5 tries. The concerning thing with the gauge is that the needle appears to be on 35 before any pressure testing? Harbor freight brand.

 

[mikidymac]

Sounds like a junk gauge.
Places like Autozone loan them out.
PTO is rear MAG is front.

 

[shattered00]

Depressed. Got another gauge.. Both of them at 90 after five tests each. Already about 360 into the ski. Sad day cause it ran so good minus the wot issue and idle issue.

 

[ORION '95 Speedster]

90 PSI is barely enough to run. The good news is that replacing the pistons and honing the cylinders is not hard. If you can turn a wrench you can fix the problem. I'm guessing the total cost will be $200, and the time would be 2-4 hours labor. Easy fix.

 

[shattered00]

I have the time and will have the money in few weeks. I am also on par with a chimpanzee as far as mechanics so I should be able to turn the wrench! I will search for a guide in here. Thanks for the reinvigorated hope! This is a ski from my childhood so it means something to me as far as yalls help!

 

[Ankeneyou]

If it ran in the water I still question even the 2nd gauge. With 90psi I don't think it would have even started in the water.

Where are u in Texas? Anyone close to you with a known good gauge or can test the gauge on a good engine?

 

[shattered00]

I am in north Richland hills. Is there a way to test the compression gauge to see if it is off? Against a known variable that is. I don't have any other known good engine to test it on. Also Home Depot had Sioux chief micro fuel line 3/32. Hope that is acceptable to the Tygon which they didn't have.

 

[ORION '95 Speedster]

Another basic test is to put your finger over the spark plug hole and crank it over. If your finger gets pushed out of the way and compression is released, that is generally considered to be 100+ PSI. It is thought that a person can not contain 100 PSI with the thumb no matter how hard they try.

 

[Ankeneyou]

I've tested gauges with my air compressor before, not really sure of any other method. I'll be in austin next week is why I asked location, but looks like you are too far north.

I personally never do a finger test. I don't like risking 2 stroke oil going directly into my bloodstream. Leaky crank seals can fill cylinders and shoot out with some incredible force.

 

[mikidymac]

Yes fingers over the hole have been known to injure people and is not an accurate check of compression anyway.

 

[RodInEscondido]

Yep, if you got such different compression readings, try a third gauge. You should be able to take the odd one back for refund. I have 3 since I almost made a bad decision based on compression readings, but I also have several skis to mess around with. Yes, you can test with an air compressor, but are then dealing with another gauge ... it is an almost endless loop.

pto stands for power take-off: where the engine connects to the drive shaft.

mag stands for magneto which is inside the cover on the front side of the engine.

 

[96spxpos]

also, make sure when you thread that gauge in, that the single rubber o-ring is seated on there, and is flush, not pinched or torn. .that'll give you bollocks readings..

 

[shattered00]

I just got some time to tinker with the compression gauge since the group felt it was off. Upon trying to test for compression again, I can feel air leaking from the male connection to the female connection and I cannot put Teflon tape around the threads since they are on the inside of the female section. I will be returning the Harbor Freight one and trying to find another store around here that sells what will hopefully be a quality compression gauge.

In the meantime, I have decided to move forward even if the pistons are shot since Speedster advised that the fix will only be around $200 and something that a novice can do. That being said, I am replacing all of the oil lines and oil filter per Ankeneyou. Below is the parts list.

http://partsfinder.onlinemicrofiche...seadoopwc&a=30&b=12&c=0&d=-OIL-INJECTION-TANK

I need to order 25, 26, and 27. I presume that Tygon will be good for the 8mm and 12mm as well? Am I missing any other oil lines that need to be replaced (I have the oil injection 3/32)? Also, I read in another post by Dr. Honda that a grommet on the oil reservoir can fail. Which part would that be in the diagram that needs to be replaced, 10 or 11 or both? Thanks as always for y'alls altruistic help.

 

[mikidymac]

Replace #10 and 11. They both can be the cause of a leak.

 

[Ankeneyou]

Good luck, hopefully compression is good once you get a good gauge. As far as topend I think the minimum you could get away with is going to be $3-350 by the time you get pistons and your cylinders bored with all required gaskets.

I would not suggest a topend only anyways but rather a complete rebuild. You would be putting a new top end on top of a 21 year old worn crankshaft. You may get lucky and get a season out of it, or it could fail within hours with the stress of a fresh topend.

I'd suggest something like Seadooengineshop.com. You can get a great deal on a complete rebuild especially on the upcoming black Friday sale. 600 or less depending on the sale but you'll have a fresh engine with 1 year warranty.