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What you think about this spark plugs 97 gsi.
- Thread starter ricardo1
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RebuiltSeadooBaffles
Member
I agree, they look good, slightly on the rich side
manolocross
Well-Known Member
What kind of oil are you using!!! It better not be a Tcw-3 oil or I'm gonna pull my hair out!!!!!
Sportster-2001-951C-Stock
Well-Known Member
If you must read plugs(I advocate looking at them for signs of trouble, like snow-white or gray ceramic insulator), then this site is acceptable to me:
http://www.seadoosource.com/sparkpluginfo.html
Looks like yours have been running recently at low(er) speeds, in which case I'd say it looks acceptable. If you do a high speed plug chop, I would like to see them clean up a bit, with a color change on the grounding strap where the strap heats to sluff off deposits.
How does the piston crown look?
http://www.smellofdeath.com/lloydy/piston_diag_guide.htm
Here's an article written by an actual expert (see bottom of page, how to read plugs)
http://www.strappe.com/plugs.html
At least you can say there are no air leaks, they look like they're on their way toward fouling but I'd bet if you took a high speed run they'd clean up and be good for some more low speed operation.
Oh, and instructions for how to test plugs:
The Float Test: The first thing to do is take the boat to a lake (clear water preferred), remove the spark plugs, one at a time, and place them in the palm of your hand. Slowly lower the plug into the water, then turn your open hand palm side down, watch the plug carefully. If it sinks it's time to replace the plugs.
You should see my plugs, they've been in several machines and have been kicking around for over 10 years. They even have rust on their wrench flats.
http://www.seadoosource.com/sparkpluginfo.html
Looks like yours have been running recently at low(er) speeds, in which case I'd say it looks acceptable. If you do a high speed plug chop, I would like to see them clean up a bit, with a color change on the grounding strap where the strap heats to sluff off deposits.
How does the piston crown look?
http://www.smellofdeath.com/lloydy/piston_diag_guide.htm
Here's an article written by an actual expert (see bottom of page, how to read plugs)
http://www.strappe.com/plugs.html
At least you can say there are no air leaks, they look like they're on their way toward fouling but I'd bet if you took a high speed run they'd clean up and be good for some more low speed operation.
Oh, and instructions for how to test plugs:
The Float Test: The first thing to do is take the boat to a lake (clear water preferred), remove the spark plugs, one at a time, and place them in the palm of your hand. Slowly lower the plug into the water, then turn your open hand palm side down, watch the plug carefully. If it sinks it's time to replace the plugs.
You should see my plugs, they've been in several machines and have been kicking around for over 10 years. They even have rust on their wrench flats.
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Sportster-2001-951C-Stock
Well-Known Member
In that case, I'd say you could go a little leaner on the high speed mixture but don't go too far, you just want the ground strap to lighten up a little so the deposits will begin to burn off, like the first plug on this page:
http://www.seadoosource.com/sparkpluginfo.html
If you go too lean, you will roast a piston, too rich and your top end RPM will suffer some, turn it back a little and see if the top end RPM comes up any. If running WOT and the RPMs begin dropping off, it's most likely because your pistons are too hot.
But you're close to where you need to be, just looks a hair rich. Put av gas in there and it will wash your piston domes clean b/c high octane burns so cool, the only way to tell when burning that stuff is by ground strap color.
If you really think you're leaving power on the table, then do a WOT plug chop and have a look, those are the conditions where you must not be too lean and your engine is running it's hottest, sometimes coming off the throttle from WOT, a partial lean seize can happen if the mid range is too lean.
So go slow when turning back the fuel, any power loss means you went too far, the leaner you get the closer you are to detonation. Fuel grades can change as well, lower octane fuels are more prone to detonate, and detonation eats pistons.
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Sportster-2001-951C-Stock
Well-Known Member
Yep, the high speed screw. If you were running your ski on the main venturi (over 70% throttle) then judging by your plug it's a little too rich. The ceramic insulator will continuously collect soot if it's too rich, and high speed operation burns it off if it's not too rich.
Judging by your plug, it's not a high speed chop test b/c the insulator nose and ground strap especially, should be cleaner than that, and the ground strap should show a color change on it's length.
So I kinda think if this plug was in an engine running hard(at max temp), it should have less soot on it. It only takes a couple minutes of WOT running for the soot to burn off like it should, if the mixture isn't too rich. You could try turning your high speed mix screw in maybe 1/8 turn increments to see if WOT RPM improves. If WOT RPM doesn't improve, then you were there, put it back where it was.
If WOT RPM begins to trail off at any time, then you've gone too lean, you want to run as rich as you can at WOT without loss of RPM.
The plug will be brown to black at mid range throttle, it doesn't reach max temp under those conditions.
Plugs are self cleaning if the WOT is set up correctly, too rich and they won't clean up, you probably aren't getting max power at WOT, if the plugs aren't cleaning up.
See the pic of the plug with the ground strap color change. This is want you want to see from your WOT chop.
http://www.seadoosource.com/sparkpluginfo.html
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Ha HA the float test.
how often should this test be done? I better start buying plugs by the case.
a bunch of people hwere i live use tcw3 and do not have problems lol
bigJake
Well-Known Member
they have problems, they just don't know it yet. it's like having a terminal cancer growing inside you. You're feeling great, then all of a sudden, not so great, then the next thing you know, you are dead.
Sportster-2001-951C-Stock
Well-Known Member
TCW3 will work for a while, especially the synthetic grade, but it has no ash and ash is a lubricant that hot engines need. Mine (951) had TCW-3 in it when I bought it, and it looked like brown gum was forming around the ring lands. I don't know if it was synthetic TCW-3. I switched it to XPS-II and the area around the ring lands has cleaned up considerably, the rave valves don't have carbon on them anymore either, they have a sticky oily film on them now instead.
I would be hesitant to run TCW-3 mostly due to deposits in the ring lands that would build over time due to the heat involved, but I like the benefit of having metals in the oil, I feel that would be an important feature if the engine was run hard, and I'm pretty sure there's not as of large margin for error on the 951 due to bore size.
Dr Honda
Well-Known Member
TC-w3 oil is NOT an instant death. But... it can't properly support the HP and RPM's these engines run. Unless you run a full synth TC-w3... you will significantly shorten the life of the engine. AND... I am unsure the issues it can have on the brass gears in the RV.
As far as the plugs......
If that's the engine they were from, that's disassembled in the background... post pics of the piston crowns.
As far as the plugs......
If that's the engine they were from, that's disassembled in the background... post pics of the piston crowns.
Sportster-2001-951C-Stock
Well-Known Member
I hear they don't run as long depending on if they have good quality lube in them, the motor in the background could be a TCW-3 motor?
I recommend everyone interested should study Gordon Jennings' series of articles closely to really get the info on how to obtain a proper tune, from a bonafied expert.
http://www.superbikeplanet.com/001114b.htm
Sportster-2001-951C-Stock
Well-Known Member
How much oil is enough, and when is it too much?
Ask Gordon Jennings:
http://www.bridgestonemotorcycle.com/documents/oilpremix6.pdf
Ask Gordon Jennings:
http://www.bridgestonemotorcycle.com/documents/oilpremix6.pdf
donkey
New Member
"The Float Test: The first thing to do is take the boat to a lake (clear water preferred), remove the spark plugs, one at a time, and place them in the palm of your hand. Slowly lower the plug into the water, then turn your open hand palm side down, watch the plug carefully. If it sinks it's time to replace the plugs."
this clearly came from a spark plug sales person.
OR,i can use my good plugs as bobbers while fishing!!
this clearly came from a spark plug sales person.
OR,i can use my good plugs as bobbers while fishing!!
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