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SBT Blacktip mats

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I'm sorry that I posted FACT based on a measurement that is/was taken with a measuring device, yet you think your eyes are a precision measuring device cuz you've been using them for 30+ years? Give me a break!

If you want to send me your samples, I would be happy to measure them with a caliper and take pictures, as I can almost guarantee you that your eyes are wrong.

But believe whatever you want, from this point forward I'll just discard your comments as unfactual unless you post proof otherwise.

It seems any time someone challenges your non-fact based opinions you want to argu, if you ever want to shut me up all you have to do is show me hard facts/proof, but you can't/won't do that so yes I AM going to challenge your input/posts.

If anyone wants pictures of the readings shown on a calibrated measuring device *I* would be happy to show them.

-TheChad
 
I'm sorry that I posted FACT based on a measurement that is/was taken with a measuring device, yet you think your eyes are a precision measuring device cuz you've been using them for 30+ years? Give me a break!

If you want to send me your samples, I would be happy to measure them with a caliper and take pictures, as I can almost guarantee you that your eyes are wrong.

But believe whatever you want, from this point forward I'll just discard your comments as unfactual unless you post proof otherwise.

It seems any time someone challenges your non-fact based opinions you want to argu, if you ever want to shut me up all you have to do is show me hard facts/proof, but you can't/won't do that so yes I AM going to challenge your input/posts.

If anyone wants pictures of the readings shown on a calibrated measuring device *I* would be happy to show them.

-TheChad


Wow......

This is a forum for helping people. You don't need to be so abrasive. A lot of your posts make you come off as very arrogant. There is no need for that.

Look at one of your spark plugs. They're gapped to 0.020"..... so you're saying that your eyes can't tell that the two pieces of metal aren't contacting each other because the human eye can't see that small of a distance? If you put both mats next to each other on a flat surface and one was that much thicker, I'm pretty sure you could tell.... just because he didn't get the same results as you does not automatically mean that he's wrong and you're right

Just chill out and be easy with the attitude... like I said, we are all just trying to help each other and post our experiences and opinions
 
If you put two sheets of material right next to each other and line up the bottoms, i'm pretty sure that it is possible to eyeball them....


Opformark - did you have anything on your ski before you put the turf down? I have to remove the factory mats on my yamaha, and it looks like its gonna be a huge pain
Yes I had some sweet purple hard as hell Seadoo mats that were riveted down to the deck. I had to drill out each rivet, clean the deck of all the nasty grime that was under the mats and seal the many small rivet holes with sealant. It took easily twice as long to get the yuck off the deck and clean then seal the holes than it did to put the mats back on. Do you have riveted on mats or worse yet, glued down ones? If they are glued down some "goo be gone" might be a good suggestion for you. Good Luck!
 
Sorry, Opformark, this is your thread, but

Wow...as much as I wanted to let this go...let me rebut.

yet you think your eyes are a precision measuring device cuz you've been using them for 30+ years? Give me a break!

I never gave any precise measurements..you did. I just said one was thicker than the other. My son's kindergarden class is going over a "Bigger and Smaller" lesson this week. Perhaps I can send some of his lessons your way as you apparently were out sick that day in your class.

It seems any time someone challenges your non-fact based opinions you want to argu...

Who's arguing? Perhaps you should go back and read the thread (notice how it goes all crazy around your second or third post :ack:). I never doubted your findings. I actually used yours to help my conclusion.

And, I DARE you to go find one other post of mine where someone challenged my statements and I argued. You have the whole arsenal of my posts at your fingertips...go find it and cite me.

if (theChad != delusional)
sky = falling;

I can almost guarantee you that your eyes are wrong...

I don't know...they seem normal to me??..??.
1.gif


if you ever want to shut me up all you have to do is show me hard facts/proof,but you can't/won't do that

Who ever said I can't or won't?? The voices again?? Seriously...keep up with your meds.

I colored the edge of the hydroturf with a black marker to add some contrast as the two sample are very close in color.
27.jpg


That is a 10lbs weight resting on the Hydro-turf and I am using the tip of the marker to hold the BlackTip mat flush
28.jpg


What are your eyes telling you???

29.jpg
 
That is a 10lbs weight resting on the Hydro-turf and I am using the tip of the marker to hold the BlackTip mat flush
28.jpg


What are your eyes telling you???


First of all, I'm not even going to comment on all your name calling. Prehaps you've spent too much time in kindergarden class.

I prefer to teach my kids NOT to act like people like yourself.


Moving on...

This shouldn't make a difference but I did order my BlackTip samples from WCSS. You said you ordered yours from SBT. They SHOULD be the exact same, but there's obviously a difference in thickness from your sample and mine. HOWEVER there is no reason to assume that the difference in thickness is from Blacktip as it could just as easily be from HydroTurf. That is another reason I was hoping you actually measured your samples with a caliper.


(Blacktip Left, Hydroturf Right)
 

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Moving on...

This shouldn't make a difference but I did order my BlackTip samples from WCSS. You said you ordered yours from SBT. They SHOULD be the exact same, but there's obviously a difference in thickness from your sample and mine. HOWEVER there is no reason to assume that the difference in thickness is from Blacktip as it could just as easily be from HydroTurf. That is another reason I was hoping you actually measured your samples with a caliper.

Finally, a rational post from you. I just don't get why it took all of the last 5-6 posts for you to accept what I was seeing. Why do you automatically disregard what I saw, instead of giving me the benefit of the doubt? Do you think I come on here to intentionally mislead people and give false information?

I come here to learn and to help others with knowledge I may posess, and I take it that is why you are here too. But allow others to have different opinions without immediately becoming combative about it. And in this thread, why was it not possible that some "samples" of mats could possibly be different than yours?

You do come off as being very arrogant, this is not name calling, it is a valid observation. I choose to come to this forum and not some of those "others" because the people here are not like that and they treat everyone else like they are a friend right from the start.

And, I'm sure your over it, but don't sweat the "jokes" from my post before. I was just trying to make light of the situation and make some people laugh.

We good?
 
Do you have riveted on mats or worse yet, glued down ones? If they are glued down some "goo be gone" might be a good suggestion for you. Good Luck!

Unfortunately mine are glued down! Ugh. This will be fun...

I have some goo gone extreme remover that i used on the old registration decals. I'm going to try to work with that, then switch to gasoline or acetone (carefully) if that isn't doing enough. Some people on a different forum said to toss on some goo gone and let it soak for a while... I guess i'll play it by ear and see that works!

Thanks!
 
Finally, a rational post from you.

I agree about your post.


I just don't get why it took all of the last 5-6 posts for you to accept what I was seeing. Why do you automatically disregard what I saw, instead of giving me the benefit of the doubt? Do you think I come on here to intentionally mislead people and give false information?


I didn't automatically disreguard your findings, I actually accepted your findings because I haden't got my BlackTip samples yet, then I got my samples and measured them only to find out what I posted and you see in my picture above.

You however were knocking BlackTip from you first post when even at that time you knew nothing about them or even had seen their samples, so of course after reading your 'findings', then seeing/measuring what I found, I definitly doubted your ability to report honest findings. Your opinion was skewed from the start.

Remember a few posts back I said "If you want to shut me up all you have to do is show me hard facts"? Well you finally posted a pictures of your findings instead of just telling me "Well my eyes tell me there is a difference in thickness". You have to be reasonable, why would I believe that knowing that you didn't really like BlackTip from the start and my findings were completely different?

Once you posted a picture, that ends my questioning your findings because I can see it for myself and elimates the possibility of you having a bias.

If you would have posted that picture to begin with, It would have saved alot of headache.


I come here to learn and to help others with knowledge I may posess, and I take it that is why you are here too. But allow others to have different opinions without immediately becoming combative about it. And in this thread, why was it not possible that some "samples" of mats could possibly be different than yours?


I do allow others to have a different opinion, however if something is stated as fact like "The sky is yellow", I know the sky is blue not yellow so I am going to try to put out the correct information and not just allow the person to convince everyone else that the sky is really yellow, ESPECIALLY if I posted first that the sky was blue and the post "The sky is yellow" was posted to directly argue with my origional post about the sky being blue. (Obviously this is just an example).

Now if the same person posted "IMO I think the sky is yellow, I know I don't have any proof or fact to back that up, it's just what I think" then I would not say a word because they did not say it in a way that challenged my information and they said it was just their opinion and not based on any fact. THAT is allowing someone to have their own opinion.


You do come off as being very arrogant, this is not name calling, it is a valid observation. I choose to come to this forum and not some of those "others" because the people here are not like that and they treat everyone else like they are a friend right from the start.


It's not that I'm arrogant, I do ALOT of research and information digging about ALOT of things, I'm a facts person. Alot of people like to believe whatever the news tells them, or a commercial, or a magazine, or an advertisement, etc. I couldn't care less, I want to see cold hard facts before I believe any of it.

I don't post on something I don't know anything about, I just ignore the post all together, IF I do post on something that I have an opinion about but no facts, I will state that It's my opinion, or that I've been told by a reliable sorce, etc.

You seem to post your opinions like they are fact and that's where we have issues. Especially if you post a skewed opinion before you have ANY facts to back it up.

The problem with the internet in general with forums, blogs, magazines, etc is that the majority of information out there is opinions, bias information and all around not fact based information. It makes it hard for me, you, everyone when you want information about a product or service, etc and you do your research to spend your hard earned money on the right product/service the first time only to find out that you didn't because the information you read in your research was not fact but opinion or bias information (Many times in advertising/reviews payed by the manufactures to be bias).

That said, I do hope in the future we can both maybe be more open minded to the information we both share and accept the differences of each others point of views.



Good.

-TheChad
 
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You however were knocking BlackTip from you first post when even at that time you knew nothing about them or even had seen their samples, so of course after reading your 'findings', then seeing/measuring what I found, I definitly doubted your ability to report honest findings. Your opinion was skewed from the start.

theChad, please re-read my posts...

How did I knock Blacktip from the start?
 
DSW, goo gone is your friend. All the factory mats on my boat were glued down. I heated them up a bit with a heat gun and scraped them up with a plastic scraper. Then spray the goo gone on and let it soak for like 10 minutes. Come back and the glue wipes off. I used a whole roll of the blue shop paper towels. Once you get it all off, wipe the area down with alcohol and you are good to go.
 
DSW, goo gone is your friend. All the factory mats on my boat were glued down. I heated them up a bit with a heat gun and scraped them up with a plastic scraper. Then spray the goo gone on and let it soak for like 10 minutes. Come back and the glue wipes off. I used a whole roll of the blue shop paper towels. Once you get it all off, wipe the area down with alcohol and you are good to go.


What about the sand-paper like traction grip that's moulded into the foot well? Do you have to sand down or anything to put the new glue down mats on? Does that traction grip affect the PSA's gripping ability?

Thanks,

-TheChad
 
What about the sand-paper like traction grip that's moulded into the foot well? Do you have to sand down or anything to put the new glue down mats on? Does that traction grip affect the PSA's gripping ability?

Thanks,

-TheChad

I cant give my opinion on the SBT stuff, but I can tell you my experience with Hydroturf with the adhesive.

My boat as well as most SD boats, have the whole interior done in the sand paper like stuff from the factory. The turf is made to fit right over those areas. It is cut almost exact to fit those textured spots. I didnt sand any of it down. Peel the backing off and stick it down. I put heavy weights on it to hold it down a couple hours.

It has been on 2 seasons now and is still stuck like it was meant to be that way from the factory. I have zero complaints.
 
theChad, please re-read my posts...

How did I knock Blacktip from the start?

Your right, my apologies on that.

It was RFoster130.


Anyway, with that all behind us. I am still curious where this variance is coming from, is it Black Tip or Hydro Turf.

I also have to consider that these samples are being cut from scrap which is possibly out-of-spec product that is good for a sample but not for the final product.. (From either company)

I have to say the BlackTip swirl pattern is much nicer then HydroTurf's. I still think I will do what I said from the beginning and order 1 hydroturf mat for my wife's ski and 1 black tip mat for my ski, then I can get a true 1 to 1 comparison of both products. Though unless we find more inconsistancies I think the 2 product lines are going to be pretty much equal.

-TheChad
 
Your right, my apologies on that.

It was RFoster130.


-TheChad

Dude, what are you smoking? Where in all of this did I knock blacktip products? My only comments were my opinion or facts about Hydroturf. If you go back and try to actually read, I didnt say 1 single word about Blacktip.
 
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I cant give my opinion on the SBT stuff, but I can tell you my experience with Hydroturf with the adhesive.

My boat as well as most SD boats, have the whole interior done in the sand paper like stuff from the factory. The turf is made to fit right over those areas. It is cut almost exact to fit those textured spots. I didnt sand any of it down. Peel the backing off and stick it down. I put heavy weights on it to hold it down a couple hours.

It has been on 2 seasons now and is still stuck like it was meant to be that way from the factory. I have zero complaints.

Awesome thanks.

-TheChad
 
DSW, goo gone is your friend. All the factory mats on my boat were glued down. I heated them up a bit with a heat gun and scraped them up with a plastic scraper. Then spray the goo gone on and let it soak for like 10 minutes. Come back and the glue wipes off. I used a whole roll of the blue shop paper towels. Once you get it all off, wipe the area down with alcohol and you are good to go.

Thanks RFoster, I'll give that a shot! :cheers:
 
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