Rxpx 260 help

[denzel]

Sorry post is so long
Hey guys I have a 2012 rxpx 260. Have a little dilemma I'm hopin u guys can help me with. I bought the ski new in 2012 but barely used it since. Only has 19 hours on it. I have never seen the 68 mph top speed on it. Most it's ever done is like 55 56 mph at wide open throttle on near glass. Dealer said it will open up more when its fully broken in so that's wat I always choked it up to. Anyway It sat winterized for the last two seasons due to personal reasons and So I go to take it out finally last week and it was running really rough and wouldn't go over 40 mph. It clearly wasn't running on all cylinders. I changed plugs it didn't help so I called my dealer where I usually bring it and they recommended me to another place so they can actually water test it. I dropped it off there and long story short it ended up needing new injectors. All covered under best warranty so no big deal, $50 deductible plus tax done deal. Here's where the dilemma comes in. The girl calls me yesterday afternoon and tells me it's good to go come pick it up tomorrow since they were closing soon, ok cool. A Little while later the guy calls me and says she was wrong it's not ready. when they water tested it after replacing the injectors they realized it needs a new impeller and ring and he said its gonna cost $700 cuz it's not covered under warranty. He said its from suckin up rocks which has happened so I can't really argue much there. I told him let me think about it. I'm supposed to call him today and let him know to order parts or not. So here's my questions. Should it cost that much to replace oem impeller and ware ring? Idk exactly how much the parts cost but 700 seems excessive to me especially for oem parts. Which brings me to my next question. Should I go with oem replacement parts or am I better off upgrading to something better? Suggestions? And also I watched a YouTube video of replacing the impeller on a rxtx 260 which I assume is the same as the rxpx, doesn't seem that hard. Is it recommended as a diy job? Or am I best off just payin up the 700 letting them fix it so I know it's right and should finally hit that 68 mph? Thanks in advance for any help and again sorry this was so long.

 

[go_panthers]

Personally, I think I would see if the injectors helped your problem. If they did, then you know you at least made a step in the right direction.

Removing the jet pump is pretty easy. You can do that yourself. Then check the impeller and wear ring. If you feel you need them, then you have two options: 1) take just the pump to the dealer and let them do it. (Should save a little labor). Or, 2) buy a few peers and tools and do it yourself.

The only way I can imagine it should cost that much is if they are rebuilding the pump while replacing the impeller and wear ring.

There are several more experienced guys that may have some different options for you.


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[jimmaki]

Since you bought it new and is still breaking in, it's illogical the impeller and wear ring would need replacing unless rocks or something hard went through the pump and damaged both. Do you recall driving over rocks or through floating debris and hearing a noise or a change in rpm? The wear ring is designed to take the brunt of it being about 1/10th to 1/5th the price of the impeller. Do you know what kind of condition the impeller and wear ring are in now?

Before shelling out $700, I'd ask the dealer if he can take some pictures of them and email or I'd go down and look at them myself. Your impeller may be repairable or may qualify as a core trade-in on a remanufactured one which run around $50. New ones are about 5x-6x that. Wear rings are cheap.

Since the ski is so new/low hours, if it were mine I'd put on a stock impeller and finish breaking it in and see where it stands against advertised performance. With OEM parts, the dealer won't have an out if the ski isn't performing up to par. Once everything is good, if you want to get more out of it, you can always start buying high performance parts.

There are more than enough You Tube videos around showing you how to change impellers and wear rings on SeaDoos. You'll need a $20 special tool, and a vice and wrench to get the impeller off and a saw or chisel/hammer (or freezer) to get the existing wear ring out.

$700 seems like the dealer plans to do more than just replace the impeller and wear ring. A trained mechanic should be able to change both in under an hour.

 

[XP 787]

Since you bought it new and is still breaking in, it's illogical the impeller and wear ring would need replacing unless rocks or something hard went through the pump and damaged both. Do you recall driving over rocks or through floating debris and hearing a noise or a change in rpm? The wear ring is designed to take the brunt of it being about 1/10th to 1/5th the price of the impeller. Do you know what kind of condition the impeller and wear ring are in now?

Before shelling out $700, I'd ask the dealer if he can take some pictures of them and email or I'd go down and look at them myself. Your impeller may be repairable or may qualify as a core trade-in on a remanufactured one which run around $50. New ones are about 5x-6x that. Wear rings are cheap.

Since the ski is so new/low hours, if it were mine I'd put on a stock impeller and finish breaking it in and see where it stands against advertised performance. With OEM parts, the dealer won't have an out if the ski isn't performing up to par. Once everything is good, if you want to get more out of it, you can always start buying high performance parts.

There are more than enough You Tube videos around showing you how to change impellers and wear rings on SeaDoos. You'll need a $20 special tool, and a vice and wrench to get the impeller off and a saw or chisel/hammer (or freezer) to get the existing wear ring out.

$700 seems like the dealer plans to do more than just replace the impeller and wear ring. A trained mechanic should be able to change both in under an hour.

Get pics before shelling out that kind of money. IMO it seems like the dealer is trying to make a few extra bucks off you. Why call and say its ready then change your mind? Someone must have told her it was done in the first place.

 

[denzel]

Yea I agree with wat everyone is saying. Pick it up ride it and see how it goes before investing more money.

 

[denzel]

Since you bought it new and is still breaking in, it's illogical the impeller and wear ring would need replacing unless rocks or something hard went through the pump and damaged both. Do you recall driving over rocks or through floating debris and hearing a noise or a change in rpm? The wear ring is designed to take the brunt of it being about 1/10th to 1/5th the price of the impeller. Do you know what kind of condition the impeller and wear ring are in now?

Before shelling out $700, I'd ask the dealer if he can take some pictures of them and email or I'd go down and look at them myself. Your impeller may be repairable or may qualify as a core trade-in on a remanufactured one which run around $50. New ones are about 5x-6x that. Wear rings are cheap.

Since the ski is so new/low hours, if it were mine I'd put on a stock impeller and finish breaking it in and see where it stands against advertised performance. With OEM parts, the dealer won't have an out if the ski isn't performing up to par. Once everything is good, if you want to get more out of it, you can always start buying high performance parts.

I edited my post cuz I forgot to mention it has sucked up rocks in the past....wat is the full break in on these?

 

[Coastiejoe]

Pretty easy job to do. $700 is WAY to much. You can do it with OEM parts for half that. Or, get an OEM wear ring and an aftermarket impeller. Gain some performance and still half the cost.


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[denzel]

UPDATE:
I picked up the ski today tested it out and runs great. Strong just like it's supposed to be but Still only hittin max speed of 56 mph. At full throttle the rpms go up to about 8200 was the highest I saw and drops back down to 8000 and jumps around in that area. So here's the question now. Is it the impeller and wear ring causing it to not go 68 or is it because it only has 20 hours on it and isn't fully broken in yet?

 

[Revo]

Break in is 10 hours. You see max RPM at 5 hours or so when the ECU unlocks completely. At 20 hours you are definitely fully broken in. If you're seeing full RPM then that's a good sign and now I would lean toward the pump being the issue (all the power is not being transferred to the water/into suction force/into jet force). Take a picture of your impeller and post it here so we can see how bad it is to see if it appears to have enough damage to put a 10mph+ dent in your top speed. I GPS'd my GTX Limited (a bigger, heavier ski) at 69mph with my Garmin and it's 100% stock. Your lighter RXP should see at least the factory rated 67mph top speed.

 

[Coastiejoe]

For comparison. My RXT-X hits 72 with a tiny chop and 68 regularly.


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[denzel]

Yea I'm gonna get under it today and see wats wat. I'll take pics for u guys

 

[jimmaki]

If it's running strong it probably just needs a new wear ring and maybe a new impeller ... just not a $700 one.

 

[denzel]

Here's the pics. Idk wat it's supposed to look like but I deff think this is my problem. It has some pretty big gaps in it

 

[Coastiejoe]

It almost looks like the leading outside edge of the blades have been filed or sanded down. The gap should be the same all along the blade edge. Yours looks to start narrow and get wider as the blade gets to the leading edge.


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[denzel]

I'm gonna replace the ring and impeller...can anyone point me in the right direction as to what impeller to go with? Idk if I wanna go oem or after market. If after market which one do I need exactly? I looked up the solas but there's so many different options idk wat to go with. And also can someone tell me what else I will need to do the complete job? Wear ring and impeller, any gaskets or seals or anything else?

 

[jimmaki]

I would go with a stock OEM impeller for that engine and hull. While it's under warranty run stock parts and baseline performance, both out of the hole, top end and doing whatever you use it for be it water skiing, tubing, racing, etc. The OEM impeller is a general "all around" compromise so if you find there is a particular area where you want more performance you may then need to go to a different impeller. If, for instance, you can't pull three 200 pound water skiers up on slaloms and you want to do that a lot, then you may want to get an impeller giving you more bottom end out of the hole. But you'll give up some top end speed in the process. It works the other way too ... you can get a few more mph on top end with a more aggressive pitch but it could cost you time out of the hole and take longer to get up on plane.

It's like what are the best tires to put on my car? Snow tires work well in snow, not so much at high speed on dry hot roads. Bigger wheels will go faster for the same engine rpm, but will take longer to get up to speed or a differential with a lower gear ratio. So at some point you end up chasing your tail.

The hydrodynamics of keeping pumps hooked up to the water involve the engine power and torque curves, aggressiveness of the intake grate, pump diameter, etc. etc. The impeller is only one element in the equation.

Once you know what area of performance you are trying to improve, then you either have to compromise in other areas or change the whole equation by making engine performance mods, stiffer pump materials, different intake grates, etc. And those requirements change depending on whether you ride mostly in the ocean, on lake chop or river glass.

Most of the aftermarket impeller sales go to people who are increasing power by making intake, FA, timing and carb mods and changing out intake grates and other pump components which oem impellers were never designed to handle.

Since you've never experienced what the system will do WOT ... try it as designed first. You may find that's all you need or want. If you want appreciably faster, then get a boat/pump/impeller/grate/etc. designed to handle a bigger engine. There's really no replacement for displacement. Otherwise you're chasing little improvements with bigger and bigger dollars.

 

[denzel]

Thanks Jimmaki that deff helped clarify a few things for me. I was reading over some of my old threads and I've been havein problems wit this ski since the day I bought it smh. luckily most was minor. But the speed was one. I don't know why I don't remember it like this but Reading thru my old thread I was sayin that I was hittin 60 when it had 8 hours on it. Then later on I said I might have seen the 68 top speed but I wasn't sure. So going by that I guess I have hit the top speed or at least close to it and just don't remember it. And in another thread I was asking about upgrades for more top end. I Always wanted more out of it.

I was originally thinking exactly wat ur sayin just go all oem as a baseline and take it from there. Still kinda am leanin that way But I noticed the the price difference between oem and aftermarket isn't that drastic so started thinkin maybe I'm better off just going after market.

For now my goal that would make me happy is to be able to hit or break 70 mph consistently. Ideally I would like to leave the ski stock but without all the stupid ass restrictions. Mph and boost mainly, rpm I'm not to worried about cuz I'd be afraid to over rev the stock internals. My thinking is that if u eliminate those it should easily hit 70+ without upgrading anything else. Now obviously the only way to remove them is reprogram or replace the ecu. Both of which void the warranty. I like the vtech setup cuz u can flash back anytime u want but the price is steep and I don't wanna spend that much on upgrades yet if ever.

So basically wat I'm thinkin is I'll get either the Riva SCOM or RnD Boost box to over ride the mph limit. And since its plug and play the dealer shouldn't know cuz I can just take it out and won't void warranty. Any suggestions on which is better?

As far as the impeller I'm still undecided. I'll probably just end up going with oem and an override box and take it from there. But just to explore my options a lil. Let's assume it will hit the 70 mark with just one of the over ride boxes on a stock impeller, then in that case maybe I would like to go with something with a lil more acceleration to get up to that 70 faster. that is if it wouldn't affect the top speed any lower then 70. I mean if it does hit say 71 72 and it drops to 70 no big deal but any lower I wouldn't be happy. As I said 70 is my goal for now...on the other hand if it won't do 70+ with just an override box which would make it pointless btw then Maybe I should look at something with more top end to hit the 70. The options are endless lol. Any feed back is greatly appreciated.

And Im wondering if u or anyone can explain to me what the different numbers represent on impellers and how they work, wat they mean? I'm just trying to understand the difference from one impeller to another.

 

[jimmaki]

Well, you're welcome. If top end speed of 70mph or more on that ski is your primary goal, you're going to need more than a different impeller.

I don't know anything about reprogramming PWC ECU's or how it affects the warranty. I guess that's up to the dealer. I do know if you bypass the limiter and up horsepower, boost pressure, throttle plate position, fuel maps, etc. you have to tune the impeller to get the max rpm at the target with the added horsepower. There are a lot of variables so I can't say get this or that impeller. The numbers don't mean much anyway and they don't mean the same thing from manufacturer to manufacturer. If your tune is programmed for 8300 RPM max, you want an impeller that loads it to that rpm.

Have fun! Personally, if I'm going 70 mph on or over water, what I'm riding better have wings.

 

[JoeZ]

Just wanted to chime in here. We've had great success with the SCOM. http://www.pwcmuscle.com/speed-control-override-module-2011-icontrol.html

That said, if you're looking for future performance gains as well, V-Tech tuning is a strong option as well. I know you mentioned warranty, but we haven't yet seen one of our customers get their warranties voided for using this.
http://www.pwcmuscle.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=v-tech