Questions Re: 2005 SeaDoo RXT S/C

[KefirSeaDoo]

When someone has a moment, please provide me with the answers to the following questions for a 2005 SeaDoo RXT S/C: (Thank you in advance)

1. Normal Oil Pressure (psi) : __________

2. Normal Fuel Pressure (psi) : ___________

3. Normal Engine Compression per cylinder: ________

4. Any other important PSI readings that I have left off.

5. Maximum RPMs/ Maximum MPH (All based on stock engine)


Performance Question:

In the water I have trouble achieving a maximum RPM of 7900 to 8000 RPM....I usually hit a maximum of 7600 RPMs@60mph or so (via Seadoo speedometer)....NOW....Outside the water (on the trailer) I am capable of revving the engine dry with a very quick squirt of the throttle to 8200 RPM......What does the aforementioned information point to as to why I have trouble hitting the 8000 RPM mark on the water? All systems are properly functioning, wear ring is in sound condition, impeller is in sound condition, oil level is appropriate. Testing regarding the aforementioned is at sea during semi-glassy conditions.

Misc info:

70 hours on PWC
Rebuilt S/C, Rebuilt PTO Assembly, Rebuilt Oil Separator
Oil level 1/2 way (right in the middle) of the bend on the dipstick
ALL needed Maintenance performed

Maintenance Question:

My PWC is stored under the California sun of at least 100° in the shade. I have removed both seats and stored them in my garage. The PWC is covered with the factory Seadoo cover at all times. There are times during the day where the watercraft is scorching hot even while it is covered..... any suggestions or concerns you should be aware of? Is it true that it is wise to cover the wheels of the trailer as well?

Thanks in advance

Kefir

 

[Michael211_2000]

In the water I have trouble achieving a maximum RPM of 7900 to 8000 RPM....I usually hit a maximum of 7600 RPMs@60mph or so (via Seadoo speedometer)....NOW....Outside the water (on the trailer) I am capable of revving the engine dry with a very quick squirt of the throttle to 8200 RPM......What does the aforementioned information point to as to why I have trouble hitting the 8000 RPM mark on the water?...

My PWC is stored under the California sun of at least 100° in the shade. I have removed both seats and stored them in my garage. The PWC is covered with the factory Seadoo cover at all times. There are times during the day where the watercraft is scorching hot even while it is covered..... any suggestions or concerns you should be aware of? Is it true that it is wise to cover the wheels of the trailer as well?

Thanks in advance

Kefir

Supercharger isn't working. With no load, sitting on the trailer, your engine will go up to the max rpms (as far as the throttle will let it)... but in water with the pump loaded you're not making 215 hp so it can only turn so fast. Jet pump's take horsepower to turn, and they absorb pony's... when all the available pony's have been absorbed, the pump cannot be turned any faster! Pull the SC air intake hose and try to turn the air impeller by fingertips... it should be nearly impossible. If you can turn it pretty easy, then you have a SC problem.

100F in the shade shouldn't make your hull scorching hot. It shouldn't be any hotter than the ambient air temp, if it's really in the shade and not getting any direct rays. The heat alone isn't much of a concern, but any rays making it to the hull will cause plastic parts to slowly disintegrate over years. The gelcoat will fade, plastic parts will become brittle and break. It's best that the hull be kept completely out of the sun when not being used, and of course wipe the plastic/vinyl parts down with protectants and give the hull a good coating of wax every spring to protect them from the sun's rays. Smooth plastic parts like the hood can also be waxed and that will help protect them!

- Michael

 

[KefirSeaDoo]

Good Call Michael!

Took the hose off of the S/C and there was evidence of engine oil, which indicates to me that the O-Ring for the S/C failed. These f#*%ing S/C are nothing but trouble.....What a poorly engineered performance part! Anyway, all this and I recently had the S/C rebuilt.

My SeaDoo is really starting to get to me....1st the PWC is maxing-out at 50mph since the S/C wasn't working, 2ndly was the S/C rebuild and the PWC is maxing out at 7500 rpm @ 58-59 mph (GPS reading) and the latest has been 7200 rpm @56-55mph with a mid-ocean LIMP Mode occurance that required me to kill the engine every 15min when the "Oil" warning came on and a continuous lengthy single beep. Had to take the key off the post (5) times until I made it back to the marina.

The PWC was blowing out more white smoke than normal and today after removing the S/C hose I saw evidence of oil in the hose. Attempted to spin the impeller with my fingers and that sucker wasn't budging....At least it's not blown again.

Tomorrow's Repair: New O-Ring in the S/C (I'm thinking that's the cause of the evidence of oil in the hose), New Oil Pressure sensors both front and rear (changing these out b/c of the "Oil" warning on the LCD, Seadoo Upgraded these components and it's a cheap preventative maintenance thing for my model ski)

So pissed that I can't achieve 70 mph @ 8000 rpm.......Impeller - OK, Wear Ring - OK, Engine Oil Level - OK, Spark Plugs - New NGKs.......I'll do an oil and fuel pressure test.....Arrghh!!!!

 

[Michael211_2000]

Well, there's a reason we call them "infernal machines"! LOL!

Seriously though, you are having more than your fair share of problems with that one. I'm not sure why a blown S/C o-ring would cause it not to work right though... unless that's letting the air go into the engine crankcase instead of into the carb? Either way it's gotta be fixed though as you noted. I'm curious to hear if fixing that o-ring in the S/C makes a horsepower difference under load! I bet that's what's going on, it's leaking air pressure thru the o-ring back into the crankcase, thus robbing the carb of air pressure it needs to make hp!

It shouldn't be blowing out white smoke at all! White smoke is not normal operation for a 4-stroke engine. Sipping oil thru the S/C I suppose? Fix that problem, and then if you continue seeing white smoke you have another issue somewhere. Also your rpm numbers seem awefully high for your mph (I was only turning 5200 rpm's to make 50 mph after all, in crappy water conditions at that).... I don't understand that. :-(

The winds are already starting to blow here today and I'm not even done with my morning coffee, but later this week the forcast is for < 10mph winds finally so I'm going to try to slip away from work early and run up to the lake for a late afternoon joy ride and see if it's calm enough to get above 60 mph safely... will let you know what my rpm readings are.

ps. You should have been able to turn the air impeller in the S/C at least a little by fingertips pressure (not easily, but it should move). Be sure to torque the nut on the end of the shaft down to the correct ft/lb's when you change that o-ring! I theorize that you may have too much resistance to the air impeller slipping (like almost no clutch effect at all), and if you got off the throttle suddenly the air pressure in the S/C may have spiked blowing out that o-ring! It makes sense, if the S/C can't stop blowing air quickly when you let off the throttle suddenly... that's what the S/C clutch washers are for, and why they're supposed to be able to slip when needed.

pps. And clean the threads with some acetone, allow to dry, then apply red loctite before putting the nut back on and torquing it! Details, details, details... so many thing you have to do just right or else. :-(

- Michael

 

[Michael211_2000]

Good Call Michael!

Took the hose off of the S/C and there was evidence of engine oil, which indicates to me that the O-Ring for the S/C failed. These f#*%ing S/C are nothing but trouble.....What a poorly engineered performance part! Anyway, all this and I recently had the S/C rebuilt... So pissed that I can't achieve 70 mph @ 8000 rpm.......Impeller - OK, Wear Ring - OK, Engine Oil Level - OK, Spark Plugs - New NGKs.......I'll do an oil and fuel pressure test.....Arrghh!!!!

The more I think about it, the more certain I feel in my gut that your S/C rebuild is actually the root cause of your problems. The slip is far too tight on the air impeller, at high rpm's you let off the throttle suddenly and it couldn't slip so the air pressure spiked and blew out the o-ring, now you're loosing boost air pressure into the engine crankcase so the engine isn't making the correct horsepower under load. I don't know what happened to necessitate your S/C rebuild, but if it had previously blown (as you said at least it's not blown this time) I fear you may now have metal pieces/particles blocking an oil pump screen starving it of oil triggering the limp mode and low oil pressure alerts. I don't think changing the oil pressure sensors will cure this problem. I'd pull the oil pumps out and inspect them and their pickup screens for debris!

ps. I'm not a professional mechanic, but I grew up around tractors and 18 wheelers and stuff and helped work on them alot and I was taught NEVER to run an engine up to WOT without a load on the engine (ie. full throttle on a boat or SeaDoo without it being in the water and in gear if applicable). Bad things can happen when you rev an engine to high rpm's with no load on it. Just fyi.

pps. There are more technical ways of checking the S/C slippage, but by my readings online if you can just barely turn the air impeller by 2 fingertips and your thumb, with some force, you're in the ballpark. If it turns easily, you have a problem.... and conversely, if it won't turn at all you have a problem!

- Michael

 

[KefirSeaDoo]

Hi Michael!

Thanks for taking the time on this issue. To clarify something, in the past when the supercharger was rebuilt the ceramic washers also got sucked into the PTO assembly and oil separator assembly. I have since extracted the engine and replaced all scored components in the two assemblies. I even had the oil sifts/nets replaced.

I simply have to get to the bottom of this. I have to find out why my watercraft is not reaching the 8000 RPM on the water. My mechanic will be taking apart the supercharger today with me and I will be watching him like a hawk hoping that I have some idea of what is wrong.

I have been looking high and low, including the shop manual for my 2005 seadoo RXT, to find the proper to work setting for the nut located at the end of the shaft of the supercharger. ANY IDEA WHAT THAT TORQUE SETTING SHOULD BE?

I am hoping to hear back from you today being that he is supposed to arrive at my home in about four hours!

Thank you for your help!

Kefir

 

[Michael211_2000]

I think the oil screens have probably got more debris clogging them now. This is why everybody hates those blasted cermic washers, when they fail and fall apart it's a mess trying to get the inside of the engine completely cleaned out again. This is the most logical explanation why you're now getting that error code and limp mode... much more likely than bad oil pressure sensors, given what you say happened to the SC prior.

22 ft/lbs is the torque on the SC shaft nut, as per my reply to your other posting.

- Michael

 

[KefirSeaDoo]

Most of the blasted ceramic washers were recovered from the PTO and Oil Assemblies.....the 2 sifts do a good job in collecting the bits and pieces...I remember picking them out.....I remember seeing quite a bit of evidence in the oil filter of ceramic washers before the fix....i might look to replace the oil filter again as well as inspect it....Oil Pressure sensors are known to go bad on my model with the LCD OIL warning when the craft takes a wave beating.....and that i took....10 miles of it!

 

[Michael211_2000]

Mmmm, okie-dokie then. Hope you're right and it's that simple.

Friday afternoon when I was at Lake Livingston in Texas, I went into some seriously rough waters around the end of a peninsula... I got smacked hard a few times myself. Oh did my ballz ache Friday night! LOL!

Advantage: Jetboat with normal seating arrangement!

- Michael

 

[KefirSeaDoo]

Michael,

I'll send you a cup to wear for your next ride! My mid & lower back always ache after riding in rough seas, since you always have to stay elevated off the seat in dem' rough waters for a more comfortable ride.

As for my mechanical issues, all I have to say is, " Mutha $%#^@, Son of a %#*^@!!!!!" - So what's the root of my problem? - A FAILED Oil Pressure Regulator....And where is this part located? - Yes, at the bottom of the engine. So I'm going to lose some days as my mechanic dismounts and pulls the engine out to swap the part. Meanwhile, I'm going to have him check the PTO and Oil Assemblies for any remnants of ceramic washer bits. I will also have him switch out the front and rear oil pressure switches.

Proper oil pressure when the engine is cold is 56 to 60 PSI
Proper oil pressure when the engine is warm is 40 PSI

It was interesting to watch, since we connected the oil pressure gauge and it gave us a cold PSI reading of 60 and then slowly tapered down to 30 psi once the engine was warmed up and would not adjust upwards even with full throttle.

I tested the mechanic's knowledge on the torque setting for the supercharger nut and the son of a gun was on point!

Anyway, OPS could be fine, but I'm going to switch them out anyway......What a freakin' headache with this model/year SeaDoo & S/C issues....I'm going to file a small claims suit against SeaDoo for all this nonsense I have to deal with b/c of the ceramic washer failure in my given year/model.....I will post the outcome and EVERYONE is to jump on that bandwagon in the event I am victorious!

 

[Michael211_2000]

Wow! So what then was the deal with the Supercharger? Why was there oil in the air line to the carb?

An oil pressure regulator, at the bottom of the engine? I had my 2006 4TEC engine split in two to change a bent connecting rod last Fall (it came to me thatta way), and I saw no signs of a regulator in the bottom of the engine. There's the oil pumps on either end, the crankshaft, the counter-balance shaft, and the PTO assembly (which I did NOT go into!). And I do not understand what it would need an oil pressure regulator for anyways, I don't believe automobile engines have that.... fuel pressure regulator perhaps, but oil pressure regulator? Hmmmm..... IDNK.

OPS... Oil Pressure Sensors?

I do not know why BRP does not take responsibilty for the ceramic washers issue, other than replacing them if the engine is still under warranty... I don't think automotive manufactures could get away with such an engineering mistake. Maybe it's because it's a purely mechanical issue that doesn't affect the boat's safety, since the failed ceramic washers haven't physically injured anybody or caused any deaths, only financial loss? Sometimes these cermic washers actually last a long time, one guy posting on here recently said he had 180 hrs on his SeaDoo with original ceramic washers (SC never rebuilt or anything!) and it was still doing ok.... no idea how that is possible, though.

- Michael

 

[KefirSeaDoo]

Michael,

There's a spring-loaded Oil Pressure Regulator and opens and closes at the bottom of the engine. If a dumbass PWC mechanic overfills your engine with oil, it's probable that you'll screw-up your Oil Pressure Regulator, either by locking it in the open position or close position....Many assume that it's an OPS issue, b/c of the "Oil" warning on the LCD and Limp Mode....but that's not always the case.

As for the Supercharger, the jury is still out on that one....We're pulling the engine tomorrow and taking apart the S/C to see what the problem is with that part. I'm still convinced it's the o-ring.....I should know by tomorrow or Weds.

 

[Michael211_2000]

There's a spring-loaded Oil Pressure Regulator and opens and closes at the bottom of the engine.

I wonder if they did away with that regulator in the 2006 model's engine, cause I saw nothing like that in the bottom/inside of my engine when I had it apart last Fall. I had my engine split in-half, pulled the #1 piston out changed the connecting rod and all the connecting rod bearings (on the other 2 pistons as well) then re-assembled and re-installed the engine... the only thing I didn't pull apart was the head and the PTO assembly. I even had the front oil pump off the engine... I saw nothing like you describe.

If you can, get a pic of this thing and post it on here I'd like to see where this thing is and what it looks like! Maybe it's 2005 specific....

Thanks!

- Michael

 

[KefirSeaDoo]

There ya go brother....It's a fragile component too that's prone to fail. This will be my last SeaDoo (and I just bought this freakin' thing 3 months ago).

 

[Michael211_2000]

Ah-hah! Yeah my 2006 should have that too then.... as I said, I did not go into the PTO part of the engine. Looks like this oil pressure regulator would only regulate the rear oil pump given where it's located. Interesting.... thanks for the diagram! Ridiculous that SeaDoo designers made a part that requires access to the underside of the engine to service, that's just plain bone-headed. :-(

But before you swear off SeaDoo's, do go Google other brands of PWC (Kawasaki, Yamaha, Honda, etc.) ... you'll likely find just as many issues with practically any of them. They'll be different issues, but no less vexing to their owners I'm sure.

- Michael