DI Seadoo Fuel Pump

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Instaled the new pump and the ski started after 3 attempts, ran like it did the day i got it reved it up and sounded great. I eventually stopped it with the stop button and now it doesnt want to run again. Starts for 3 seconds and stops. All I did after the stop is tightened the bolts on the top of the fuel module. I then removed the whole module and all seems ok. I did a test outside with just the pump and assembly (fuel hose and sliding aluminium tube and there is no leaks, also the pressure is so great that I cannot keep the end closed with my thumb. Wish I had a pressure guage

I am now lost. 2 different pumps and the same result, starts, runns till i stop it and then doesnt run again. What could it be? Could the injectors be blocked? Guess not otherwise it wouldnt start at all. Battery voltage is at 12,8 when idling.

I didnt change the in line filter but if I removed the connector just before the fuel rail fuel does come through when I have the lanyard on, could this afecting the pressure?
 
Before you tightened the bolts holding the pump module to the tank top, could you feel the spring compressing fairly easily? Sometimes if the module isn't sitting right, the spring doesn't compress properly, then torquing the nuts down just distorts the tank and puts stress on the module.

If you have the pump module out and the outlet hose disconnected, you should be able to blow fairly easily (by mouth) through the fuel filter to see if it is clogged a bit. If you don't want to remove the Oetiker clamps, then blow through the plastic sliding seal tube. It is "fairly easy" to blow air through only after you have already blown hard enough to empty the fuel from the filter.

You can build an inline pressure gauge pretty easy and fairly cheap using fuel quick connects, a barbed T fitting, high pressure hose, hose clamps, and a gauge "stolen" or borrowed from a cheap compression tester. Unless you can measure the fuel pressure as the Seadoo is trying to start, you won't know if achieving 107psi pressure is an issue. Your test of removing the fuel line at the rail only shows low pressure flow.
 
I've also been looking into this DI fuel pump issue, and can say that DooWacka is right on the money with all of these posts.

gideon, just a shameless plug.....I have two of the high pressure Airtex pumps for sale right now. Both brand new, and I have flowed them on my bench (actual fuel pump flow bench) and have full flow and current draw curves. Either of these pumps will get you going. Here's the link:
http://www.seadooforum.com/showthread.php?48391-Two-DI-electric-fuel-pumps

Advertisement aside, I've been looking into alternative pumps myself, as I work on fuel systems for a living. And let's just say that I know the DI system very well from the inside out. What DooWacka said about the original Airtex pump was dead-on: The original was a positive-displacement pump with a special DC motor winding to be able to run at the high system pressure (107psi) and achieve the low current draw. This is certainly not a standard automotive pump. It is presently out of production, and I believe what is in BRP's Sherbrooke service parts inventory is all that is left. And of course you have the buy the whole module to get the pump. So it's not looking good long-term about keeping these DI machines going unless an alternative is found. The key is, as DW has said, is find a pump that can do the pressure (there are a few out there), but at under 10A.....that is the kicker.

Stay tuned on this. I "might" have something in a few weeks. I need to buy some pumps and get on the bench before I let the cat out of the bag.
 
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I dont get it, tried again this morning and it started first time. Quikly opened the water and had it run for 5 min reved up perfectly and I eventually stopped it myself. Now it doesnt start, I am convinced the fuel pressure just isnt enough at start up, could this be? Why does it run fine when it actually starts? Is there a fuel pressure regulator or something that might be faulty?
 
As I said, until you can monitor the fuel pressure, you won't know if you should be troubleshooting something else completely different and unrelated. There is a fuel pressure regulator in the rail, and also one for air pressure. If a test gauge indicates 107psi while running, then they both are working. There are tests described in the manual ( I assume you have a manual) to test just the pump, and also the fuel rail circuit, but you need a test gauge.
 
Ah Ha! Think I found the problem. I spoke to a tech at seadoo today and he told me to pinch the return line and try to start. Ski starts imediately time and time again, he seems to think it might be the fuel pressure regulator. I will remove it tonight and see what I can find.

Again this could probably have been confirmed by a pressure guage, I am getting one on Monday.
 
You may have to install a Schrader Valve to connect your guage. I have brought many pumps back to life by cleaning the internals by
mixing Toluol (tolueen) 1 part to 4 parts gas, in a small can, imerse the pump 1/4 way, apply 12v, tap on pump to get it started, and loop
a clear fuel line back into can and circulate the mix. You'll be suprised at the all the gook from the pump.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbzEeWy1b3o&feature=relmfu

Bills86e
 
Ok so I initaly sorted out the fuel issue by buying a refurbished pump, never got a after market pump to work. Ski has been running fine for about 3 to 4 hours but its now screwed again. If I connect a presure guage I get 95psi (6.6bar) on startup and goes to 101psi(7bar) when i rev it, is this normal or must it be at 105psi on idle? Would my battery @ 12.6v (when reving it) have anything to do with it?
 
After startup the pressure should go to 107psi. Most DIs are "barely" running at 95psi, and depending on the unit, either won't start or will die between about 92 and 95psi. Revving should give more voltage than 12.6v unless the battery is low. If the battery is fully charged then you should read at least 13.6v when revving. Use a charger to fully charge the battery, then start and measure voltage. If your voltage is still low then the rectifier/regulator could be bad, or your pump is drawing way to much power. Yes, higher voltage will allow a pump to run to higher pressure, however the pump should reach 107 psi even at idle. If you have a clamp style meter you can measure pump current draw without disturbing any wiring.
 
This is just one of their HFP-342 pumps, sold on their website for a variety of cars currently priced at $78.98. For the Seadoos they have thrown in both of the filters used inside the fuel pump module. The hose is very heavy duty (thick) and would replace the "sliding seal" spring loaded system of the module.

There are apparently many people using this pump with success. However, I have yet to get anyone to state on this forum how the pump is working for them.

I have installed one, and my 2001 GTX DI starts fine. I will be using it hard on a lake for a couple of weeks starting in a few days, so I will have something to report. A drawback is that the pump uses at least 12A compared to the OEM 5A current draw. As a result, the output of the magneto system will probably not charge the battery at idle, but only while running at some speed and above. That much continual current draw may have an effect on the Rectifier/Regulator module.
 
DooWacka - thanks for the quick response. I just may be able to help you with the amperage problem.

I own two (2) 2001 GTX DI's and consider them the finest PWC ever produced. The power to weight ratio has never been equaled by any other ski. Over the years I have experienced multiple regulator failures on both DI's. I got tired of replacing them and conducted an experiment. I bought a SeaDoo OEM regulator for a 2005 GTX 4Tec SC. I cut the leads off both the bad & new regulator and soldered the old leads onto the 4Tec unit. I was carefull to use two (2) layers of quality heat-shrink tubing over each of the solder connections. I have modified both DI's this way and have not had a regulator failure in 6 years. There are other riders on the GreenHulk and CanDoo Pro forums that independently came up with the same solution.

It appears that the DI voltage rectifier/regulator units were undersized from the start since the same part number was and is still used for the 1996 to 1999 carbureted only GTX and the DI units. The regulators were not beefed up for the extra amerage of the DI units.
 
That's great news Victor, I'll make one for my next replacement.
Now if someone could come up with a way of getting the magneto to put out more than about 18A, then the battery would always be getting charge. This would probably require a custom stator with many extra windings.
 
DooWacka said:
This is just one of their HFP-342 pumps, sold on their website for a variety of cars currently priced at $78.98. For the Seadoos they have thrown in both of the filters used inside the fuel pump module. The hose is very heavy duty (thick) and would replace the "sliding seal" spring loaded system of the module.

There are apparently many people using this pump with success. However, I have yet to get anyone to state on this forum how the pump is working for them.

I have installed one, and my 2001 GTX DI starts fine. I will be using it hard on a lake for a couple of weeks starting in a few days, so I will have something to report. A drawback is that the pump uses at least 12A compared to the OEM 5A current draw. As a result, the output of the magneto system will probably not charge the battery at idle, but only while running at some speed and above. That much continual current draw may have an effect on the Rectifier/Regulator module.
Click to expand...

bonjour a tous,
finalement est ce que la pompe walbro gss 342 est vraiment efficasse pour le gtx di 2002.
 
Yes, I think the Walbro GSS-342 will also be very effective as a replacement.
I also have a 2001 GTX DI with this Walbro pump that I will be testing over the next week.
I will report the findings on both pumps.
 
DooWacka said:
Yes, I think the Walbro GSS-342 will also be very effective as a replacement.
I also have a 2001 GTX DI with this Walbro pump that I will be testing over the next week.
I will report the findings on both pumps.
Click to expand...

merçi de la réponse.amicalement.
 
I spoke with highflowfuel about their DI pump. He was very knowledgeable about the situation. He claimed that the pump draws 9amps at 110psi. Not sure if this is true but he said it is not just a regular 255 but one that was originally designed to use in a mustang (apparently some need a lower amp pump?). He said they have sold lots of them with no problems. I would like to hear some first hand experience. If cleaning my sock/pump I will be buying one in a week or so.
 
Sorry, I have been out of town at the lake for a week. I did get to test my new install of the HFP-342 for about 22 hours in a 2001 GTX DI. The pump performed well and the Doo ran great! The only drawback is that my pump draws 12A so the battery does not charge at idle. A version that draws 9A would be much better, and hopefully charge the battery even while idling. I would be curious which Mustang pump.
 
I forgot to mention a couple of other things.

I also tested the Walbro GSS-342 for 11 hours in another DI, and it also ran great. It does however have the same problem of drawing 12A and not charging at idle. As I mentioned the current draw for each pump can be different, and I felt lucky to get a pump that only draws 12A. I had to remove another GSS-342 that was drawing 17A and not allowing the Doo to run well at all! I could get it started but it ran very rough and beeped since I don't believe the MPEM was getting enough power.

It is important to note that the module rebuild method I used (as shown with pictures earlier) was not robust enough to last. The OE pump has a screwed on rigid connection to the aluminum sliding-seal carrier, so the pump is held firmly at the bottom by the rubber on the inner filter, and also at the top by the rigid plastic tube the sliding-seal glides on. The wimpy plastic "support" holding the OE pump in the middle of the module doesn't have to do much. When I use the short piece of flexible fuel hose to go between the 342 pump and the aluminum sliding-seal carrier, there was potential for flex and the wimpy plastic support could not keep the pump centered in the module. With all the slamming around forces the pump takes while driving the Doo hard on rough water, the hose bent over and caused the sliding seal to angle and fail. As a solution I wrapped thin sheet aluminum (pop can) several times around the rubber hose and secured with clamps to stiffen the whole assembly. This has been working great for 22 hours. I will be experimenting with a much sturdier pump support to replace the wimpy plastic, and may not require the rolled sheet metal stiffener.
 
Just reading throught this thread and trying to figure out who's had success.

Did Gideon ever get his machine working properly ?

Has anyone used an aftermarket pump and had PERMANENT success ?

IMO , with a high pressure pump setup like this I would not be inclined to get an aftermarket one and try and make it fit with home made connections. I would worriy about things coming loose when the machine is out hammering waves and if a leak occurs things could blow up pretty quickly. Could also be a liability issue if you lend your machine out and it blows up on them....


If I find that my pump is faulty I will most likely pay for the OEM unit , besides it comes with all new filters and hoses.


On a side note. It seems that many people including myself are having problems with their 2001 DI, were most of these machines bad or is it an unlucky few that have hard to diagnose issues ?
Are new machines a nightmare as well with their complicated electronics, or was it just this generation of 2000-2002 GTX DI that were an issue ?
 
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Piper Mike said:
Just reading throught this thread and trying to figure out who's had success.

Did Gideon ever get his machine working properly ?

Has anyone used an aftermarket pump and had PERMANENT success ?

IMO , with a high pressure pump setup like this I would not be inclined to get an aftermarket one and try and make it fit with home made connections. I would worriy about things coming loose when the machine is out hammering waves and if a leak occurs things could blow up pretty quickly. Could also be a liability issue if you lend your machine out and it blows up on them....


If I find that my pump is faulty I will most likely pay for the OEM unit , besides it comes with all new filters and hoses.


On a side note. It seems that many people including myself are having problems with their 2001 DI, were most of these machines bad or is it an unlucky few that have hard to diagnose issues ?
Are new machines a nightmare as well with their complicated electronics, or was it just this generation of 2000-2002 GTX DI that were an issue ?
Click to expand...

Hi

I found a refubished OEM pump and that worked for about a month and died as well. I now got a aftermarket unbranded pump I baught from fuel injection specilists here in SA. They asked me to send the whole fuel unit to them and fitted it for me, I havent tested the ski on water yet as it was in winter but the fuel pressure is ok now. The pump is also unbranded so I cant see any model numbers or make but it looks very similar to the OEM pump at about 20% of the price.

As soon as I have testes this ski I will post my results

Cheers
 
Yes, the HFP-342 works well, as stated in this thread. However, it uses 12 Amps current draw which is to high to provide charging of the battery at idle.

"High Flow Fuel" is currently shipping a better pump that only draws 9A. So, if you order a DI Seadoo pump from them, through eBay or their site, they will send the new pump even though the listing says HFP-342. I asked them about that, and they apparently have not gotten around to changing the pictures and listing yet.
 
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