2006 seadoo RXT 26 hours Supercharger toasted

[HOTROB]

I have a 2006 RXT with supercharger issues. I took off the air intake and tried to spin the supercharger with my fingers. It turns but is kind of hard to spin, does not spin freely. Does this mean the washers did not fall apart? Can I just replace the washers with the metal ones and be good? 11,000.00 bucks and 25 hours later it takes a dump on me. My 96 Yamaha I owned for 12 years, just as fast never ever broke.


Thanks

 

[seadoosnipe]

I smiled at the part of your thread, "My 96 Yamaha I owned for 12 years, just as fast never ever broke"... I've still got my old Yamahammers, and my older 2 stroke GTX, SPI and Challenger boat. Pretty much for this exact reason. The 4TEC motor is nice, but I don't like the headaches that come with them.

You sound like you already know what's wrong with it. You seem to know that in 2005, the SC were equipped with the ceramic washers that would deteriate when exposed to synthetic oils. Then again, is there anything wrong with it? The SC is not suppose to just free spin. The washers are called "clutch washers". These are suppose to allow give between the gearing of the charger to teh motor. The SC spins over at 40,000 rpm, so if your running, get some air, the motor will spin off. WHen you land in the water and reconnect, the motor will grab the water almost instantly. THis is why you have slip washers. If the SC tried to grab instantly from 40,000 rpm, it'd break gears and shafts.

So, the answer about "hard to turn" is yes, ... it should have resistance on it. If it free wheels, the washers are worn out and need to be replaced.

 

[HOTROB]

Thank you very much for the reply. I have never worked on a Seedoo before, never had too (YAMAHA ROCKS). Since the supercharger has a little resistance, did I catch it on time?. And do all I have to do is change out those washers and am I good to go?. Or is there more to it?.

Thanks again for your help

I smiled at the part of your thread, "My 96 Yamaha I owned for 12 years, just as fast never ever broke"... I've still got my old Yamahammers, and my older 2 stroke GTX, SPI and Challenger boat. Pretty much for this exact reason. The 4TEC motor is nice, but I don't like the headaches that come with them.

You sound like you already know what's wrong with it. You seem to know that in 2005, the SC were equipped with the ceramic washers that would deteriate when exposed to synthetic oils. Then again, is there anything wrong with it? The SC is not suppose to just free spin. The washers are called "clutch washers". These are suppose to allow give between the gearing of the charger to teh motor. The SC spins over at 40,000 rpm, so if your running, get some air, the motor will spin off. WHen you land in the water and reconnect, the motor will grab the water almost instantly. THis is why you have slip washers. If the SC tried to grab instantly from 40,000 rpm, it'd break gears and shafts.

So, the answer about "hard to turn" is yes, ... it should have resistance on it. If it free wheels, the washers are worn out and need to be replaced.

 

[Michael211_2000]

What are these issues you speak of Rob? What makes you think there's something wrong with your SC?

If nobody's changed out the ceramic washers then YES you need to pull the SC out of the engine and replace them pronto they are bad mojo not worth another ride around the bend if they fail and fall apart inside your engine! But if the wheel in the SC isn't spinning freely then at least 1 of the 2 washers must still be there (if not both). It should be very difficult to turn that SC wheel by fingertips you should have to put some effort into turning it! If nothing else is wrong you can buy replacement steel SC washer kits with the tool sets needed and just replace them yourself it takes about 1 afternoon under a shade tree to do it, not rocket science at all. Getting the SC out and putting it back in takes most of the time in fact (the 3 little bolts that hold it on are not easily reached, 1 is especially a PITA).

But again, what are the issues that lead you to think the SC has a problem right now? Is the motor not running well or something? If the ceramic washers have fallen apart and down into the engine you're fun is just beginning you have to get ALL the pieces out of the crankcase and that's not a fun task at all so let's hope they're still hanging on the SC shaft!!!

ps. Is the Yamaha supercharged and does it do up to 70 mph? If not then you aren't comparing apples to apples... speed costs, how fast can you afford to go? Just saying... superchargers are a wear item and need regular rebuilding (every 100 hrs it needs to be totally rebuilt), but the ceramic washers issue is a 1 time thing they were a bad design from the start replacing them with upgraded steel washers should make it good to go till the 100 hr full rebuild.

- Michael

 

[HOTROB]

Hey Michael, The problem I have is the thing will only go about 50mph, it used to be fast. The Seedoo only has about 25hrs on it, its barley broken in. I pulled the air intake off and turned the supercharger with my fingers, it does take some pressure to turn it. It is not free spinning at all.

My 1996 Yamaha 1100 triple did not need a supercharger to hit high speeds. The thing never had one problem. 2 seater 2 stroke

Thanks Again

Rob

What are these issues you speak of Rob? What makes you think there's something wrong with your SC?


If nobody's changed out the ceramic washers then YES you need to pull the SC out of the engine and replace them pronto they are bad mojo not worth another ride around the bend if they fail and fall apart inside your engine! But if the wheel in the SC isn't spinning freely then at least 1 of the 2 washers must still be there (if not both). It should be very difficult to turn that SC wheel by fingertips you should have to put some effort into turning it! If nothing else is wrong you can buy replacement steel SC washer kits with the tool sets needed and just replace them yourself it takes about 1 afternoon under a shade tree to do it, not rocket science at all. Getting the SC out and putting it back in takes most of the time in fact (the 3 little bolts that hold it on are not easily reached, 1 is especially a PITA).

But again, what are the issues that lead you to think the SC has a problem right now? Is the motor not running well or something? If the ceramic washers have fallen apart and down into the engine you're fun is just beginning you have to get ALL the pieces out of the crankcase and that's not a fun task at all so let's hope they're still hanging on the SC shaft!!!

ps. Is the Yamaha supercharged and does it do up to 70 mph? If not then you aren't comparing apples to apples... speed costs, how fast can you afford to go? Just saying... superchargers are a wear item and need regular rebuilding (every 100 hrs it needs to be totally rebuilt), but the ceramic washers issue is a 1 time thing they were a bad design from the start replacing them with upgraded steel washers should make it good to go till the 100 hr full rebuild.

- Michael

 

[Michael211_2000]

Hey Michael, The problem I have is the thing will only go about 50mph, it used to be fast.

Rob there can be lots of reasons for that though.... is the oil level right? Middle of bend in stick, NOT at the top of the bend in the stick. What rpm's are you seeing at WOT/50mph? Should be close to 8K rpm's at WOT.

Have you pulled the jetpump to check for foreign debris stuck inside it? These things can suck up rocks from up to 3 feet away from the intake grate I've been told! What condition is the wear ring? What condition is the impeller? Rocks ding the leading edge of the impeller blades decreasing their efficiency, anything hard like a rock can cut grooves into the wear ring also causing you to lose speed. Wear rings are cheap and easily replaced, impellers not so much though.

Are the OPAS paddles raising up correctly? They are supposed to lift up as water pressure builds inside the pump... ie. the faster you go the higher they should raise. If there is a leak in the hoses that operate them you may not know it and the paddles will stay in the down position and drag in the water full time.

Most importantly though if your SC still has the cermic washers PLEASE get them replaced or replace them yourself before using it further!!! If it's not spinning free then the washers are probably still intact and there's probably nothing wrong with the SC, but those ceramics are a disaster waiting to happen you want to get rid of them ASAP.

A quick easy tooless way to check for SC operation is to start it on the trailer with the seats off and use your hand to grip the SC to Carb air hose... squeeze down on the hose and give it some throttle for a few seconds you should feel air pressure build up inside the hose under your grip. If you can't feel the hose trying to expand under your grip, then the SC isn't working for some reason. Limit run time to less than 20 seconds without water, you don't want to damage the exhaust system!!!! 15 seconds is all you need to tell if the SC is making air or not.

You still didn't tell me just how "fast" the Yamaha went. I'm sure it too could hit 50mph, but could it hit 70mph? 65 maybe? 60? What's "fast"? ;-)

- Michael

 

[Michael211_2000]

Rob is yours just like mine or do you have the Gold colored RXT? Mine's got 76 hours on it now, I changed out the SC clutch washers at 69 hours (what it had on it when I bought it used). Ceramic washers feel like plastic when you hold them in your hand, eeek!

I hit 55mph NOT at WOT this past Memorial Day, as fast as water conditions would let me go (there were alot of boat wakes/waves everywhere and it was a bit windy). Last August I hit 68 mph on PERFECT water and that still wasn't at WOT I could have gone a bit faster still.

Oh and have you changed your spark plugs recently? These 4TEC engines kill spark plugs often, I don't know why mine went bad on me on my last run last August I thought the engine had shut down on me all power went away and I had to limp it back to the boat ramp with it missing and surging like crazy... turns out the plugs had failed, even though they looked brand new (they were the plugs it had in it when I bought it used, I don't know how many hours were on them); they had no electrode wear and would actually still spark but wouldn't run right in the engine. New set of plugs and it runs great again!

- Michael

 

[ski-d00]

Have you changed your plugs?

If the sc has resistance, both washers are still in place. You are probably turning the motor when you are turning the sc impeller. You should measure the slip torque to be sure it is working properly but my guess it that it is. They typically either work or they don't and when they don't, they free spin.

4tec motor is more reliable than any other yami motor, imo, even the 700 which is pretty bullet proof. sc is just something you have to live with if you want to go fast but regular maintenance and it works very well and if you don't jam on the throttle while you're in mid air wave jumping, that's what tears them up, the high rev and instant stop.

 

[red2blue]

Whoa....hard to turn? with your finger tips?.....My bet at the very least the slip is way off. At the worst...the washers are gone.

Takes 30 min only to pull the sc. Peace of mind goes along way.

Uhm...the ski is 6years old....why only 25hrs on it?

 

[Michael211_2000]

I'd really like to hear what his RPM's were, at 50 mph with WOT. That would tell us a lot.

But yeah he needs to pull that SC anyways to get the ceramic clutch washers replaced no matter what. Took me over an hour just to put my SC back in, that 1 little bolt took forever to tighten! Arghhh! I dropped the wrench repeatedly and had to take time to fish it out from under the engine every few turns which did not help any. :-(

- Michael