04 GTX 4-tec dead SC, Engine dead too?

[saabarubie]

Hi there, new member as of today.

Our family has an 04 gtx 4-tec where ceramic washers went. (I am learning now that I should have replaced them with updated metal ones before this happened.) The ski worked great last year, but seemed to not hit real top speeds towards the end of the season, but wasn't really noted. It was brought in for winterization and summerization at a sea doo dealer. Launched two weeks ago and instantly upon powering to 3500 rpm oil alarm went on. It was immediately stopped and put back on the trailer. Oil sensor was changed by dealer and cleared for take off. We launched it and same exact thing. Second diagnosis is that the SC bearing failed along with collateral damage - 2 oil pumps and filters.

I am worried about the rest of the engine; main bearings, rod bearings, wrist pins, cylinders, pistons. I have a quote to rebuild the SC, 2 oil pumps, and replace all the clogged filters ~$2500. My concern is that I have all the work ($$$) performed only to find out that 20 hrs down the road something in the main block fails.

My questions are...

1. What is the likelihood that the rest of the engine suffered damage?
2. I am assuming that since the oil pump housing is scored that the bearing pieces got circulated. Does this sound like a correct assumption?
2. Are there other places that you can check for signs of damage that don't require a break down (i.e. stator assembly or such?)
3. The dealer said there are screens in the lube system that prevent pieces from getting to the bearings and such. Yes?

Thoughts?

 

[Coastiejoe]

When the ceramic washers fail it can be very serious or just a bit if a tear down. Have to look at the gears below the SC as well.

 

[saabarubie]

When the ceramic washers fail it can be very serious or just a bit if a tear down. Have to look at the gears below the SC as well.

Hi Joe, thanks for the reply.

1. What would I be looking for in the gears? Loose parts or damaged teeth?
2. How can I tell if I am looking at a complete or partial tear down? I read this on a separate posting....

"Did the supercharger lose parts (bearings or gears or washers)? If it's blown parts loose and into the crankcase, I'd check both oil screens (there are 2 oil pumps, one in the front and one in the back each with screens) and if you can't locate every single lost supercharger part down to the last needle bearing then pull the engine out split it open and clean it out inside! If you have any loose parts lying around inside that crankcase they can at any time get into the PTO gears or other places and cause complete engine failure (BOOM... err, more likely BANG and then silence), it's not worth the chance leaving any parts lying loose inside that engine! Everything from that blown supercharger must be accounted for if you're going to fix it right! "

Thoughts?

 

[Coastiejoe]

1). Any loose parts from the SC as well as damaged gear teeth. Normally the parts do make it to the crankcase and often the gears have damaged teeth.

2). Depends on the gear condition mostly. Big chucks fall to the crankcase and stay there. If the filters did their job the small parts should stop there. Oil pump is a concern if you see any parts in the filter.

 

[saabarubie]

1). Any loose parts from the SC as well as damaged gear teeth. Normally the parts do make it to the crankcase and often the gears have damaged teeth.

Thanks again.

1. I will ask about the PTO gears (I am assuming that those are the gears you are talking about, is that the correct terminology?)

1). 2). Depends on the gear condition mostly. Big chucks fall to the crankcase and stay there. If the filters did their job the small parts should stop there. Oil pump is a concern if you see any parts in the filter.

2. The oil pumps have been inspected and and are scored. They have been marked for replacement/rebuild. Does that indicate that parts fell out of the super charger, landed in the crank case, got sucked up by the oil pump?

3. What is the pathway for the broken parts? Through the gear housing into the crank case?

3. If parts got to the oil pump, does that mean they were in the crank case first and that there could still be some in the crank case?

Thanks!

 

[Coastiejoe]

Fall from the SC into the drive gears down to the pan. If the oil pump picks them up, then into the filter. If your gears look good and it was mine, I'd pull the engine, remove the pan and clean it out. I the filters did their job, the rest should be ok. You could always open a crank or rod bearing to look at their condition.

 

[saabarubie]

Thanks a ton. I am going to be calling the dealer with a few questions.

1. Do the washers ever come apart without the SC bearings and impeller getting destroyed?

2. The engine is already out, would dropping the pan to check things out just make sense?

3. came across this article that was pretty helpful for me http://www.sea-doo.net/techArticles/ceramic-clutch/

 

[Coastiejoe]

Washers fail and do not hurt the SC in many cases. And absolutely, if the engine is out pull the pan for sure. I'd strip all outside covers off doin could see the gears and whatnot. But I am VERY anal about my toys. In the air flying, will read the article later.

 

[saabarubie]

talked to the dealer a bit ago.

1. Do the 4-tecs have a oil pan in the traditional sense (like a car, acting as an oil sump) that the two pumps pick oil up from? If so, is it a big deal to take off if the engine is out already?

2. Is there a way for bearing parts to fall down into the pan (assuming there is one)?

3. Where do the oil screens sit between (in terms of flow, i.e. between gears and pan, pan and pump, pump and ??). Are they on the pump outlet or inlet?

 

[Coastiejoe]

Here is a picture of it.