1996 xp starting problems in deeper water lol

[tshaw]

Well I went through search and found a lot of starts on land but not water. Heres my problem my xp does not want to start in deep water well over a few feet. I usually dont ever stop in the middle of lake to jump off to swim etc. when I do and it sits for a while it will not start. When I fall off and hop back on in a few seconds it will start fine. The past few times when I shut I go to shallow water just a few feet deep then im able to jump on it and go. I know its not good to start in the shallow of water but ive got a spare pump,impeller,wear ring, driveshaft so when I suck up a rock or whatever I can change parts. Any thoughts on what it could be? Ski history my t/t reads a little over 11 hours so engine rebuild (ses) carb rebuilt (doc) wear ring, oil system, rectifier, etc all have 11 hours on them.

Thanks

 

[- BiRkS_]

Could have leaky needles and seats. Try next time shutting the fuel valve off just before you shut the engine off, then let it sit. Come back 15-20 mins later, see if it fires up easily (turn fuel selector back on too). That or the idle is too lean. If the ski still struggles after sitting 20 mins, pull the choke out and see if it kicks over. If it does, then you need to richen your low speed screws 1/8 turn, then possibly re-adjust idle

 

[tshaw]

Alright thanks hopefully I will get to try that tommorow

 

[Dr Honda]

The needles weren't leaking when I worked on them (I check for leaks, and pop-off religiously) ... but who knows... maybe something got into them. BUT.. when it's a leaky needle... Holding the throttle wide open, and cranking for 4~5 seconds will get it to go. If you suspect that as the problem... I will be happy to check them again for you for free. (I'll even cover the shipping back)


In years past... we have had issues with restarting because of:

1) Collapsed rubber exhaust hoses.

2) Exhaust leaks. (fills the bilge with fumes, and can't get the air to start)

3) Too much water in the exhaust. (internal leaks, or the metered fitting was changed for a standard fitting)



So... a couple things to try....

1) Pull the seat to get some fresh air, and see if it will start.

2) close to the shore.... get it to the point were it wont' re-start... and lift the ass end out of the water, and try to start it. (lifting the exhaust out of the water)



Now... with this all said.... this past summer, I rebuilt one set of carbs that needed a set of diaphragms, and the owner opted for aftermarket. (didn't want to wait for OEM's to come in) If that was you... then that could be the problem.


Also... I know you said it's a new engine... but are we sure the compression is good? Also... are we 100% sure than the rotary valve timing is right, and the clearance is in spec? It's it's out by a half-tooth, or the clearance is high... it will be a total bastard to start in the water.

 

[tshaw]

Thanks for the info doc I dont suspect at all that its on your end so if I discover it is needles I have no problem sending them back at my cost for laber shipping etc. Ive had the airbox off a few different times messing with the idle once I got my tto. I will try the seat trick the more I think when it does start in water the exhaust might be partially out of the water. The exuaust hoses seem ok I just had to remove the pipe about 1.5 hours of run time to weld up the freeze plugs so everything should be tight with no leaks etc.
Question on your number 3 suggestion I always start them after out of water to shoot water from the exhaust and have noticed that my xp shoots a lot more water out of exhaust then my gsxl does so maybe your on to something. Im not sure on the fittings I know the difference. It wasnt me on the carbs not wanting to wait my engine was at ses so I had all the time to get the correct oem parts. Compression is 143 and 145 not to happy with that since it has 11 hours on it but maybe its my guage
Thanks again

 

[tshaw]

Ive got an update went out to largest lake in Indiana little over 10k acres (I know its small to some of you but im driving 1.5 hours just to get to 2300 acres) I now love the larger bodies of water but hate driving 5 hours a day total to get to them.
Back to orginal post over the weekend I rode enough to use 8 gallons of gas went back to truck and filled up. Let it sit for 5-10 min and it wouldnt start in water was only about 3 feet deep rpms on tto max was 720 trying to start, removed the seat for air and it still wouldnt start. My trailer was close by so I put ski on backwards got it out of water and it started took a few seconds of cranking and quite a bit of water came out of the exhaust. Filled it up with gas and went and used another 8 gallons idle was 1520 ran perfect. Once my gas light came back on I headed for trailer again shut gas off on selector and let it run for a few seconds it didnt die out out me so maybe I didnt wait long enough. Turned gas back on and refilled and no start lifted rear up it started pushed a lot of water from exhaust then I turned off. Pushed out till it was 3 feet deep as fast as I could hopped on hit start gave it gas and it started all that was within a few seconds. Any thoughts on what it could be with a little more detail? I also waited 3 days and went out and it fires right up as it should but its been on trailer with no water that could enter exhaust

 

[CReynoldsMIZ]

Hmmm like doc honda said...kinda sounds like it may have low compression. Test it

 

[tshaw]

143 and 145 it now has 16 hours on rebuild so hoping my guage is just a little low

 

[Dr Honda]

OK.... compression is good. and since you turned off your fuel... it's probably not carbs.


The other thing that will cause hard starting is a rotary valve that's out of time, or has high clearance.

When you time the valve... flipping it will give you a "Half-tooth" of change. So... if you put it on, and it wasn't exact... flipping it will bring it into spec.

 

[tshaw]

Thanks doc I will look further into it read the manual etc to figure out what would need done.