hesitation from idle to WOT...How to eliminate?

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brock1

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Good morning everyone..... So a little background on this machine..I picked up a 96 xp with the 787 motor and when i got it it had a new motor from sbt but it had been SEVERLY neglected on every aspect.. I changed all the fuel lines...changed the fuel filter and oil filter, drained oil and changed the small injection lines, added XPS fully synthetic, cleaned the RAVES , compression is 148 in both, and i sent the carbs out to DR. honda who went through them for me, I also checke the water regulator and the clamp had fallen off so i reinstalled it and now it dosent leak anymore......NOW for the problem...The ski runs great but im having several issues still..1) If i idle around such as out of a no wake zone and punch the throttle it will hesitate for a moment then go...2) but if i idle at say 1/4 throttle then punch it the hesitation is gone..so i have narrowed it down to being only from idloe to WOT...I also think that im not getting my full rpm's out of this ski...my GSX can beat it in a straight line race ..NOT by much but it will....3) also if i shut the ski off for say a min or 2 then go to start it i have to hold the throttle wide open and crank it for maybe 5 sec before it will start...any insite into this problem would be helpful..thanks everyone
 
Brock,

I have had a very similar problem with my 96GSX, it's been not been quite right all summer. I know this isn't going to help much but the problem is something in the carbs. I have the luxury of having an extra set of carbs., so I put the extra set on, everything cleared up. The carbs. I took off are the newer style with the accelerator pump. The carbs. I took off were almost new the guy gave them to me when I bought the ski last year.

I'm gonna send the carbs. I just removed to the Doc. this winter and have him go through the so then I'll know they're right. I suspect either bad needles and seats, wrong jetting or pop off. So you might want to check those things. See you later you big pr**k. LOL

Lou
 
Hey just ride it like that.
It probably carbs.

No carb is tuned to perfect conditions.

Your probably going rich on 1/4-2/3 throttle.
Try closing LS 1/4 to 1/2 at a time to get better result.
Once you found it open it.
Then try going out on the HS at WOT.

Lou could probably find his thread on same thing faster than I can search
 
How much does the Doc charge for going over some carbs? Also, if I'm putting in a higher compression engine, do I need to do anything to the carbs?
 
HAHA you must have looked at that other thread ......OH well some ghuys are like that and i take some of the blame....as far as the jetting and all that goes i dont really know im thinking of just buying a set of 44mm buckshots to go on it and being done with the problem but i would rather TRY to fix these than drop 600 on a set of carbs.... i forgot to mention that i tried setting the low speed screws a few diff ways....tried 1 out tried 1 1/4 out tried 3/4 out tried 1/2 out still no change i just dont know where to go from here
 
How much does the Doc charge for going over some carbs? Also, if I'm putting in a higher compression engine, do I need to do anything to the carbs?

charges 65 for labor (one hour) and whatever parts you need....good investment in my opinion.....and as far as the higher comp....i wouldnt think so maybe just diff. jets
 
Brock,

Here's the thread I had started on the same subject. However the problem never completely cleared up until I changed the carbs. It got better, but never ran the way I wanted it to. As you probably already know I'm just a little excessive compulsive when it comes to my ski's. I suspect you are too.

http://www.seadooforum.com/showthread.php?50728-Hesitation-96GSX&highlight=

Oh and the carbs. on the ski now are set to the factory settings.

Lou
 
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Brock,

Here's the thread I had started on the same subject. However the problem never completely cleared up until I changed the carbs. It got better, but never ran the way I wanted it to. As you probably already know I'm just a little excessive compulsive when it comes to my ski's. I suspect you are too.

http://www.seadooforum.com/showthread.php?50728-Hesitation-96GSX&highlight=

Oh and the carbs. on the ski now are set to the factory settings.

Lou

Well there you go.

The one solution is go WOT when no one looking.
 
You will not meet another guy that is more obsessive compulsive about his toys than i am....My vts will not work and it driving me CRAZY. Its kind of annoying being this way because i get yelled at evry time we go out by the woman for constantly stopping and adjusting things...she always just asks why i cant just ride the darn thing ...... Its just the way i am i wish i could just get this thing going right and By the way LOU im sending you that cover today ok its going in the mauil around 1 ...dont want ya to think i forgot about ya....anybody know where i could get some carbs...does anyone have a set of KNOWN GOOD carbs they wanna sell
 
Brock,

The best place for carbs. is EBay in the off season, last year I picked up a good clean set for the GTI for under $100.00. However right now the prices are high. You could also try PM'img minnetonka4me.

Lou
 
ok ill do that....i just read your entinre thread and it seems that what you did workede for the most part but i wonder why is nevcer COMPLETLY clears up......any ideas why im not getting my full rpms out of my ski...the GSX should not be able to beat it....
 
ok ill do that....i just read your entinre thread and it seems that what you did workede for the most part but i wonder why is nevcer COMPLETLY clears up......any ideas why im not getting my full rpms out of my ski...the GSX should not be able to beat it....

Actually my GSX will beat my XP, but not by much. I think the hull especially in a straight line of a GSX is faster.

I was ready to call it quits with the carbs. on my GSX untill I ran it on the hose, something I hardly ever do. The ski would almost run away, rev. to about 4600 4700 and come back down, that's when I decided to put the spare carbs. on.

Lou
 
I did those carbs... so... let's see what we can do.

1) how bad is the stumble? Does it try to die?

2) If you roll into the throttle is it better?

3) what RPM is the stumble? (a guess is OK)
 
I did those carbs... so... let's see what we can do.

1) how bad is the stumble? Does it try to die?

2) If you roll into the throttle is it better?

3) what RPM is the stumble? (a guess is OK)

well.....it dosent try to die it just kinda dosent go at first then will rev right up and go but it acts like it has to think about it first LOL ....ummm if i roll into the throttle ......well to be honest i havent tried but it does seem to be better if i slowly accelerate instead of just punching it.so i guess YES ..........as far as where the stumble is it seems to be the whole way from idle to 1/4 throttle anywhere in there if i gun it is will hesitate...past 1/4 i can go like heck and be fine no hesitation
 
all the way IN....Ok ill give it a try i thought that only had an affect at higer RPM's......not contradicting just trying to learn...if that worked what would that tell you...
 
well.....it dosent try to die it just kinda dosent go at first then will rev right up and go but it acts like it has to think about it first LOL ....ummm if i roll into the throttle ......well to be honest i havent tried but it does seem to be better if i slowly accelerate instead of just punching it.so i guess YES ..........as far as where the stumble is it seems to be the whole way from idle to 1/4 throttle anywhere in there if i gun it is will hesitate...past 1/4 i can go like heck and be fine no hesitation

Sounds kind of like the carbs on my 787 when I first rebuilt them. They seemed to have a lean hesitation from an idle to WOT but from 1/4-WOT it ran fine. I ended up running 1 1/8 turns open on the LS with a pop-off of around 22-23psi. 1 turn was too lean and 1 1/4 was way too rich. Just the smallest adjustment made a big difference for me. I ride at about 1000' of elevation so your settings will vary. I would ask if you made sure to clean out the microscopic pores thoroughly but if Doc cleaned the carbs Im sure he did.

Also, I have no experience with anything other than stock size carbs but I would think you would have a harder time trying to tune the larger 44mm than the stock 40s. Just because with the stock ones you already know pretty much what size jets and needle settings you need, you just have to optimize them for your riding conditions.
 
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so for the most part your other set of carbs will run pretty good then?......if so wanna sell

Yep, it runs pretty well, but not as good as with the set that's on the ski now. The carbs. that are on the ski now are original to the ski, the set I took off have the accelerator pump so they are for a 97 and up 787. I don't think I want to sell them, unlike sqrl I can't keep an extra engine, but I can keep extra parts.

Right now I'm sorta looking for an extra pump, I will rebuild it and just keep it for standby like the carbs.

Lou
 
Yep, it runs pretty well, but not as good as with the set that's on the ski now. The carbs. that are on the ski now are original to the ski, the set I took off have the accelerator pump so they are for a 97 and up 787. I don't think I want to sell them, unlike sqrl I can't keep an extra engine, but I can keep extra parts.

Right now I'm sorta looking for an extra pump, I will rebuild it and just keep it for standby like the carbs.

Lou

ok no big deal i dont blame ya...I guess from here ill just wait to see what doc has to say...he asked me a few questions that i answered so we will find out....ill also try what whiskey said and see if that makes a diff.thanks for the help guys
 
Try tightening the red RAVE caps all the way in.

This is really interesting, I rebuilt all four RAVES on both of my 787s. The caps were all the way in when I took them apart and when I reassembled them I brought the caps flush. Both of my 787s do exactly what Brock described here, When going from idle to WOT theres a hesitation.
 
Sometimes... putting a little more pressure on the RAVE's will help. Basically, if they open pre-mature... you loose a little torque. So... if you keep them tighter... then they can process the low fuel better. I personally run mine full tight.


Brock... is it better/worse when the engine is cold/hot?

When I take my XP out... the first hit from the no wake zone... I have a stutter until I clear it out the first time. After that... it's fine, unless I idle for a long time.
 
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