98 GTS 717 cooling system routing question?

[rksnow1]

Hey guys, I put my 98 GTS w/ 717 in the water for the first time this season and noticed that the "tell tail" was not pissing any water in the back. I got the ski late last season and dont remember if it worked then.. It seemed to be running fine and not over heating but I only had it out for a quick first test run..

When I got home I blew all the lines out with air and found no blockages. Put it back on the hose to test and still no "tell tail"... Im thinking the water lines are mixed up. I've looked at the parts fiche diagrams and read through a few hundred posts last night and still am not sure.

This may be hard to describe so Ill try and attach a pic. One the top rear of the engine there are two water hoses and directional markings stamped on the engine cover.. The hose on the right has the cleanout attachment but is attached to the "out" arrow? is this seem right? Wouldnt the water want to circulate through the engine. The other end of this hose goes to the white opening through the hull, top right of the jet nozzle



If this all seems correct, any thoughts to why the "tell tail" is not working? What should I check next?

Thanks

 

[brock1]

the way that you have them hooked up is correct but the (pisser) line comes off the bottom of the exhaust manifold do you have it hooked up?

 

[brock1]

just looked at you pic again and it looks like the pisser line is hooked up to the top of the pipe and not the bottom...is that correct

 

[LouDoo]

The hose running over the head, is that the battery vent? Also the tap for the hose on the right side is not stock, but it should work, is there another hose coming off this connection?

Lou

 

[rksnow1]

The hose running over the head, is that the battery vent? Also the tap for the hose on the right side is not stock, but it should work, is there another hose coming off this connection?

Lou

The water tap I replaced. The original broke and this was the best I could find at the time. Seems to work fine...The line running over the head is the vent from the oil tank I believe goes out the back here in this picture... Ill move it to the side and take a few more photos for clarity

 

[rksnow1]

just looked at you pic again and it looks like the pisser line is hooked up to the top of the pipe and not the bottom...is that correct

The pisser line is coming from the bottom of the exhuast then feeds into this "T" and the center line in my palm goes out of the back to Pisser

 

[rksnow1]

Here are a few more pictures if these help. Thanks guys..
line from top of exhaust to lower exhaust nipple
view of pisser line. appears to start at bottom of exhaust then "T's" off to pisser and other line into exaust port by rear of hull
Top down view of lines
Another view of "T"pisser line and whereTop black hose (with water tap) exits hull

If all looks correct... I blew through all lines with compressor and no blockages found. Should these lines all be filled with water when running on hose and pisser operational? Right now I only get minimal water in the clear lines shown and no pisser..

Thanks Pros'!

 

[mikidymac]

On my 720 the pisser comes from the 1/2" hose that connects the front of the head to the pipe. There is a Tee there that goes to the pisser. Pist a picture farther forward please. The one below the manifold is the low level drain to drain water after the engine is turned off so I am not sure if this also fed the pisser on older models.

 

[LouDoo]

Everything looks to be connected correctly, the picture in post 5 is the battery vent, if you have a sealed battery you won't use it. The line for the tell tale splits, one side goes to the outlet under the tow hook, the other side goes to the exhaust outlet to cool it. That also looks to be connected properly.

Lou

 

[brock1]

did you blow air through the (T) to make sure its not clogged

 

[rksnow1]

Everything looks to be connected correctly, the picture in post 5 is the battery vent, if you have a sealed battery you won't use it. The line for the tell tale splits, one side goes to the outlet under the tow hook, the other side goes to the exhaust outlet to cool it. That also looks to be connected properly.

Lou

Lou, I traced the line Im pointing to in post 5 back to what feels like the top of my oil resevoir. Definately isnt anywhere near my battery. Should there a vent on the oil resevoir? If not.. Is it bad that my oil resevoir is vented like that? Been that way for a few years since Ive owned the ski and seems not to have done any damage, but I could be wrong.. Gotta love, when Im looking into one problem and may find another... I LOVE IT!

Any thoughts on the Tell Tail? This should work when running on the hose correct? If Im hooked up right and no blockages in the hoses, why wouldnt I get the pisser stream or a dribble at least.. Anything internal in the engine that can clog these lines inside the engine I should check?

Thanks everyone! Mikidymac, Ill post that forward pic for you this evening when I get to the ski.

 

[rksnow1]

did you blow air through the (T) to make sure its not clogged

Yeap, I have a big compressor in my shop and blew through all the lines a few times.. No clogs that I noticed, not even a little dirt or muck.

Anything internal that can break and could block the port on the bottom of the exhaust leading to the pisser tube. Im not sure if I blew through that port back into the engine, but did all the lines and top of exhaust .

 

[mikidymac]

The connection below the manifold you are talking about is the low point drain and can get plugged with sand and debris but I would not blow air into it because you could send that stuff up into the water passages. I would plug the pisser and see if you can suck air through the hose. That would tell you if it is clear without blowing that crap further into the engine.

 

[RodInEscondido]

As stated above, a picture showing more forward on the engine to include the connections on the tuned pipe would be helpful.

Section 5 of the service/shop manual shows the connections pretty well.

Seems I recall that the fittings connecting to the tuned pipe and bottom of the header (and maybe others) are rated for specific flow; to make it more confusing they look the same but have numbers on them.

I just happen to have a 98 GTS in my stable so could eyeball it and take a couple pictures if it might help.

Hope this helps a little.

Rod

 

[rksnow1]

The connection below the manifold you are talking about is the low point drain and can get plugged with sand and debris but I would not blow air into it because you could send that stuff up into the water passages. I would plug the pisser and see if you can suck air through the hose. That would tell you if it is clear without blowing that crap further into the engine.

Thanks, is the "connection below the manifold" the same spot near the bottom of the engine where the pisser tube starts (in 2nd picuture in Post #7) that you are referring to? I might be calling the part by the wrong name, my appologies if so, or are you referring to where the line meets the exhaust right before exiting the hull(picture 4 in post #7)? Ive disconnected the tubes and blown through them away from the motor trying to minimize any blow back into the coolant passages when I did blow them out.

 

[rksnow1]

As stated above, a picture showing more forward on the engine to include the connections on the tuned pipe would be helpful.

Section 5 of the service/shop manual shows the connections pretty well.

Seems I recall that the fittings connecting to the tuned pipe and bottom of the header (and maybe others) are rated for specific flow; to make it more confusing they look the same but have numbers on them.

I just happen to have a 98 GTS in my stable so could eyeball it and take a couple pictures if it might help.

Hope this helps a little.

Rod

If you have pictures of how your system is set up and the correct connections that would be very helpful. Unfortunately I dont have the shop manual any longer. I forgot to take it out of my other ski last year when I sold it : (

 

[rksnow1]

If you have pictures of how your system is set up and the correct connections that would be very helpful. Unfortunately I dont have the shop manual any longer. I forgot to take it out of my other ski last year when I sold it : (

Here are the pictures of the front tube set upView attachment 13041

 

[mikidymac]

Nope, my 720 has a third hose at the connection that you just posted that goes to the pisser.

 

[rksnow1]

After checking all of the lines I started thinking the coolant passages internally might be clogged and looked to the engine itself.

On the engine cover there are two arrows. One facing"In" towards the engine and one facing "Out" aways from the engine. I marked the In with a red arrow and Out with green arrows in the photo. If I blow air into the "In" it will come straight out the other side on the front of the engine,(I marked with Yellow arrows to show flow of air). No air comes out the red out arrow when I do this. I tried reversing the air and blowing through the out arrow and I get alot of back pressure, but If I blow through the yellow out arrow at the front of engine , It comes straight through the Yellow "In" arrow. Does this make sense? Should there be a free flow between the coolant passages in the head?

anyone know of a flow diagram out there and have a picture they can post?

 

[LouDoo]

Lou, I traced the line Im pointing to in post 5 back to what feels like the top of my oil resevoir. Definately isnt anywhere near my battery. Should there a vent on the oil resevoir? If not.. Is it bad that my oil resevoir is vented like that? Been that way for a few years since Ive owned the ski and seems not to have done any damage, but I could be wrong.. Gotta love, when Im looking into one problem and may find another... I LOVE IT!

Any thoughts on the Tell Tail? This should work when running on the hose correct? If Im hooked up right and no blockages in the hoses, why wouldnt I get the pisser stream or a dribble at least.. Anything internal in the engine that can clog these lines inside the engine I should check?

Thanks everyone! Mikidymac, Ill post that forward pic for you this evening when I get to the ski.

Sorry I didn't pick up your post earlier, the vent on the top of the oil tank is just left open nothing connects to it. I did see in a later post that you have a vented lead acid battery, I would connect the line to the battery where it belongs.

Lou

 

[RodInEscondido]

View attachment 13046 After checking all of the lines I started thinking the coolant passages internally might be clogged and looked to the engine itself.

On the engine cover there are two arrows. One facing"In" towards the engine and one facing "Out" aways from the engine. I marked the In with a red arrow and Out with green arrows in the photo. If I blow air into the "In" it will come straight out the other side on the front of the engine,(I marked with Yellow arrows to show flow of air). No air comes out the red out arrow when I do this. I tried reversing the air and blowing through the out arrow and I get alot of back pressure, but If I blow through the yellow out arrow at the front of engine , It comes straight through the Yellow "In" arrow. Does this make sense? Should there be a free flow between the coolant passages in the head?

anyone know of a flow diagram out there and have a picture they can post?

I agree with your analysis of a blockage.

looking at the manual, the cooling flow indicates the normal flow is into the IN, across the head to the opposite side which feeds the tuned exhaust. It also indicates the flow goes through the cylinder water jacket, back up to the cylinder head and to the OUT. I must assume that the water jacket feeds the exhaust header and out the fitting at the bottom of the header to the pee hole and other tubing in your above picture of the T fitting in your hand. I would recommend removing the 90 degree fitting on the bottom of the exhaust header to which the pee hole tubing setup connects and insure the fitting is not plugged. Then maybe try the below.

The pros will correct me if I am wrong, but my amateur analysis says that if you plug the outlet on the opposite side of the IN side and apply a little pressure to the IN side you should get flow out of the OUT side as well as to the pee hole tubing. Also block off the OUT side and should get air out of the pee hole plumbing. Experience with other marine applications tells me that the closer you have water flow to the exhaust the more likely you will have a blockage, especially if operating in salt water.

You can get manuals here or on-line ... go here.

I will check back in here when I get home to see if manual or pictures are needed.

Rod

 

[RodInEscondido]

Well, I have a couple good pictures, but cannot upload them from here for some reason. I will try from home a little later.

On further thought and looking at a partially disassembled 720 engine ... there are two paths of flow through the cylinder head and cylinder jackets. Likewise two paths thru the exhaust. Methinks that, if the 90 degree fitting on the bottom of the exhaust manifold is clear you will probably find the blockage in the exhaust manifold.

Rod