1996 GTI and 1995 GTX

[ochem]

I just got my hands on these two jet skis with a tilt trailer for $1000.

They were bought from an estate. Person I bought them from didn't know much about them. Young man owned them before him died about 5 years ago, his father stuck them in the back yard and let them sit. Neither had batteries, one of them (96) needs a DESS key. He said a previous looker hooked up the one to a battery and it turned over. GTX last reg sticker is 2007, GTI is 2010.

Cosmetically, they're a little roughed up, but nothing serious. I'll post some pics later
The hulls look to be in great shape.
The engines aren't seized, both fly wheels spun fairly easily, even with the plugs in.
Looks like they were stored without gas, which I believe is good thing

Before I even try and start them, I know I need to:
rebuild carbs
replace fuel lines (they still have the grey ones)
Someone here mentioned replacing the fuel selector, but I don't know if that means the Fuel selector knob, or the fuel valve?

Problem:
I'm sure I can do the work amd figure stuff out, I'm very mechanically inclined. However, I'm not terribly familiar with these machines, especially 2 strokes, and I know even less about jet skis. I've started watching videos, and reading a bunch on this forum, but I will have ALOT of questions over the coming weeks, so bare with me, and any and all help you can give is appreciated.

First questions:
Where do you like to buy parts for these? starting with carb rebuild kits.
What size battery should I get?

 

[ochem]

The seat covers are a mess too. I'm I better off getting new seats, or is it much cheaper to get foam and vinyl and reupholstering it myself.

 

[Z-man228]

I am right with you. Just acquired a 1997 GSI that needs the same things. I ordered a genuine Mikuni Carb kit online(google it and you will find them) the 717 cc motor had a MK-BN 38/44-spr part number for the carb kit and 786-35018-1.5 for the 1.5 Needle and seat. I got fuel line at the local marina. The carb was really clean but did have stuff in the filter. The fuel selector valve was (I think) the culprit as It has a bunch of green goo in it so I ordered one of those too. google it and you will find it as well. I read some can be taken apart and cleaned but I decided for $20 I wasn't going to chance it. As far As the seat goes you used to be able to buy just the seat skin and restaple it on. don't know if they are Still available online or thru this forum or not but I ma sure an upholstery shop can get it close for you.

 

[Z-man228]

and battery should be a 16 CLB Readily Available at Walmart

 

[ski-d00]

The first thing I would do is see if you can get them running. Get a good battery(walmart batteries are crap), put some fuel in the spark plug holes and see if they will pop or even start. You will need a key programmed for the 96 GTI. Too bad you aren't closer to me or I could program one for you.

Not to rain on your parade but there is a pretty good chance that the motors will need a full rebuild. My experience with skis sitting outside for years is not a good one. You will get them running but how long will they last? The crank and bearings will rust after years of sitting and then they will grenade after about an hour when on the water.

 

[ochem]

So I built my stand from scraps in my garage, and moved the GTX onto it first, since there's not much point in working on the GTI until I get a new DESS key. Got new fuel line to install, removed the carbureturs. Definite degradation in the fuel lines, but what I'm seeing in the carbs looks good, pretty clean. Can't get a couple of screws out, but some youtube tutorials point me towards the use of an impact screw driver to help out there, so I'll be picking one of those up today.

A couple of odd things:
1. Doesn't look like there was a gasket between the carbs and the manifold, that doesn't seem right? Maybe these carbs were rebuilt just before they were stored? any thoughts?
2. I noticed some plastic wing nuts lose on the engine block. After watching some videos on rebuilding the carbs, I learned they should be holding the PTO cover in place, but there is no fly wheel cover. Is this important to have?

This is the first time I've attempted anything like this. I couldn't feel more manly if I tried. More questions and some pics in the near future, count on it!

 

[Mickirig1]

Don't be afraid to ask questions. We all started new to ski's. You can down load repair manuals for free off the Internet. Make sure you use the right oil and ask questions. You need to get a pop off tester to do carb and check the fuel system. A good source for parts: https://osdparts.com / great guy, has sold me many parts. His site has great info too. These are different animals, but if you can wrench you can fix them. I live in Akron and ski at West Branch and Lake Erie.

 

[mikidymac]

There has to be a gasket between the carb and manifold.
2. THe cover helps keep things from getting caught in the driveshaft and slinging water all over the inside. I would get one for sure.

 

[ochem]

Don't be afraid to ask questions. We all started new to ski's. You can down load repair manuals for free off the Internet. Make sure you use the right oil and ask questions. You need to get a pop off tester to do carb and check the fuel system. A good source for parts: https://osdparts.com / great guy, has sold me many parts. His site has great info too. These are different animals, but if you can wrench you can fix them. I live in Akron and ski at West Branch and Lake Erie.

That's where I ordered my carb rebuild kit and added the pop off tester and internal screw set (I stripped the screws on the pin/lever side on both carbs). I live about 10 minutes from erie, that's were I was planning on doing most of my skiing if I can get these running. Family is excited and hopeful I can get these running.

 

[ochem]

There has to be a gasket between the carb and manifold.
2. THe cover helps keep things from getting caught in the driveshaft and slinging water all over the inside. I would get one for sure.

I looked more closely last night, there is gaskets left on the manifold. I'll order the cover once I get the motor working.

 

[ochem]

So last night I checked the compression on the engine. Carbs are still off the engine I thought I read that that was ok. I grounded the spark plug wires, hooked up the battery, removed the spark plugs then tested each piston. No fuel in the engine.

Good news: the two pistons are withing 1-2 psi of each other.
Bad news: they're showing 120 on the front and 119 on the back.
possibly good news: I tested the compression with the $25 harbor freight compression gauge kit, which I've seen several people here say can be inaccurate

Did I don this right? Is there anything else I should try to check the compression, put carbs back on, add fuel, test it when it's running(is that a thing? I don't know)

Figure I'll go to autozone and see if I can borrow a good compression gauge kit, is that what is the recommendation?

 

[mikidymac]

It is probably the cheap tester.

 

[ochem]

I hope so. I've seen a number of posts say you should test compression with wide open throttle. If the carb is off the engine, how can you make it WOT. Is it automatically WOT? I'm new to engines in general, so bear with the stupid questions.

 

[mikidymac]

THE ENGINE - 1) All accurate readings must be taken from a dead cold engine. A warm engine will yield slightly lower numbers. 2) The exhaust pipe and carburetor must be installed. The restrictions in the carb throat and the back pressures of the exhaust system can affect the readings. 3) Have a full charge on the battery. The speed that the engine is spun, has a significant affect on the indicated reading. . 4) Leave a spark plug in the cylinder not being measured. Contrary to what you may think, the engine will turn over slightly faster with the opposing spark plug installed.

 

[ochem]

Thanks, my rebuild kits should be in today, hopefully I can get them back together in reinstalled tomorrow.

 

[ochem]

I can't get the concern for the engine out of my mind. I was thinking of removing the top to visually inspect the pistons and cylinders. I know I'll need a new gasket for reassembly, but besides that, is this something anyone would recommend given the story of this machine? Or should I avoid it given my general newness to this stuff.

Also, after I replace the fuel lines and selector, and reinstall the rebuilt carburetors, is there anything else anyone would recommend I check? I can dissassemble and reassemble anything, just wondering what else I might want to look for.

Last, one of the gaskets on a carburetor is basically glued/disintegrated onto the surface of a part. I can scrape it slowly, but I'm worried I'm gouging the face of the surface too much. I tried soaking in WD40 which has helped, but only minimally, is there any recommendations for this?

 

[soccerdad]

You can just go slow with a razor blade and scrape the gasket off. Don't be afraid of these things. I would not worry about the compression yet. 120 should get you started anyway. By then you will have the carbs on and can do a good test with a good gauge. But focus on getting this one to test fire. Once you get it running, you can go through everything else.

The basic items are:
-Fuel system
-Empty oil tank and put in the proper oil
-Replace the small oil injection lines to the motor (home depot has it cheap)
-The PTO cover and programming for your key can all be obtained from /done by a great member here [MENTION=41828]Minnetonka4me[/MENTION]. You will have to send him your mpem (electronic box in the front) He has tons of used parts for these things and is a great and respected source. He has some new parts too. You can use the dealers, but some will rape you and others will not even work on an old ski.
-Check the wear rings. The clearance should be less than the thickness of a dime.
-Drain the oil from the jet pump and refill
-Then do the cosmetic stuff.

Also, put a battery in the 96, and use an old screwdriver to jump across the starter solenoid (the big metal lugs on the solenoid in the rear electrical box). That should turn over the motor. It won't run, but you can test that way. You can do a compression test on that one now before you do the MPEM thing.

Oh, and post pictures! We love to see ratty skis reborn! And keep asking questions. I had two of these restored before I ever sat on one in the water! They are hard to work on because of the space, but they are simple mechanically and electrically, and your 717 motors are really bullet proof.

 

[ski-d00]

There are no head gaskets on the old 2 strokes(excluding 951), only o-rings so if you want to remove the heads go ahead no problem putting them back on.

Like I said before, get them running so you know what you have. If the motor knocks like crazy you know you're in for a rebuild so pulling the motor and doing all the other stuff will be easier like changing fuel lines.

 

[ochem]

Finished the rebuild on the carb. Question about pop off pressure. Spec says it should be 19 to 35. PTO side was 20, mag side was 13. I adjusted that one to match, so they're both 20 now, but I was wondering if there is any advantage to adjusting to the top or bottom of the spec?

 

[mikidymac]

How did you "adjust"t them to match?
If they are that far off something is not correct.

 

[ochem]

I bent the arm that holds the pin slightly. I saw that on several carb rebuild youtube videos. These were new needle valves and seats. The pins, arms and springs were all reused. I was supprised how far off they were as well, but I have don't know the history on these machines. I tested three times before and three times after adjustment.

 

[soccerdad]

Did you use the springs that came in the rebuild kit? If so they are not correct. If you still have the original springs you need to use them.

 

[ochem]

I got a kit from OSD parts, they didn't include the spring on purpose. I reused the old springs, needle and arms.

 

[ochem]

pin not needle

 

[ochem]

Ok here's some pics as promised with some questions